[Advaita-l] The Evolution of Advaita from Sankara till Date
muthushiv at yahoo.com
Thu May 15 09:59:17 CDT 2008
Jaldarji, it is the most unfortunate comment i have ever heard from you. I couldn't even believe it was you writing it. What I see a vehement opposition to Swami Vivekananda (mostly out of hatered) than because of some constructive inputs in your latest mail. Swami Vivekananda is a product of various schools. His teacher in spiritual path is Sri Ramakrishna (no doubt) but Adi Shankaracharya's influence in his life is immense. The last pages of Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna will stand for it. Let us face it. Can I say Shankaracharya is a south indian and possibly he is influenced by south Saiva siddanta school and that's why all the peetams are asked to worship Shiva? This is ridiculous.
The cultural impact is basically kept aside when the theological standpoint is analyzed. Pages after pages has been written (Spoken) by Vivekananda on the topic of Advaita. Please remember he lived a short life and he traveled extensively and his audience were diverse. His contemporaries including Swami Brahmananda, Swami Abhedananda and later Swami Nikilananda were oozing the principles of "Advaita from vedantic stand point". I am not clear what you want "Vedantic" point of view. Look, the important point is to obtain the "jnana" and not "Vedantic textual knowledge". This can be given by Guru only. We read them in Upanishads (eg.Chandogya). The issue is who is the true guru which is a matter of another discussion.
You claim that Swami Vivekananda idea freezed the growth of hindu thoughts in modern india. Let me tell you not even a fraction of India's population reads any spiritual book - leave alone Vivekananda's. The modern and so called confident population wouldn't be so idiotic if they read any spiritual books. Look at the madness Indian population is undergoing. Every one wants to become either an IT professional, or a Doctor or some Engineer. The country looks like a breeding machine to me. By the way poverty and ignorance is striking in rural India. The confidence we are talking is about doing what we are worth for. That is the message of Swami Vivekananda. Infact today his message has more meaning than ever. I cherish every word of Swamiji from his lectures "Colombo to Almora".
I bet you have no Idea abt. the works of Swami Vivekananda. He is one true sanyasin who's heart was bleeding for the poor's comfort. He never sat in a corner to do tapas nor he collected some money and designed "Courses" for western people. Nook and corner of India - he and his sanyasin brothers established hospitals, schools, and charity halls to alleviate the suffering. That was their Tapas.
You say the books are available in plenty. Do you know how. Apart from some private publications it is Sri Ramakrishna ashram's personal effort so many books are available. Personally I myself recovered some old books and I gave it to Sri Ramakrishna Ashram in Mylapore which they converted into print. Their publication dept. translate every noble book of hindu philosophy in English to increase the availability. And this is called "Vision" which Swami Vivekananda possessed. Do you think any other organization would do that. All the modern day swamiji's are designing "Courses", a book and pep talk on Bagavad Gita, and some "rituals" because it looks soo cool.
You say the nature of West has changed. Let me ask you who did it first? It is Swami Vivekananda. If you dont have the capacity to show gratitude, that is alright but don't throw mud at others because first it contaminates your hand. Jaladarji, you come across as a learned man. Please dont harbor shallow thoughts.
God is Great
----- Original Message ----
From: Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>
To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2008 4:34:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] The Evolution of Advaita from Sankara till Date
On Thu, 15 May 2008, Bhaskar YR wrote:
> But prabhuji dont you think though there is no evolution in vEdAnta
> itself, there is a considerable evolutionery changes in interpretation of
> vEdAnta?? I think, the interpretations of vEdic scriptures have been
> drastically changed from the time of gaudapAda/shankara to madhvAchArya...
I guess I can allow that there has been a shift in emphasis as the
competition changed from buddhism,samkhya,vaishnavism etc. but the point
is the basis of the interpretation stayed the same throughout.
> I've seen your comments on Swamy Vivekananda somany times
> earlier...prabhuji, kindly let me know why you are taking such a tough
> stand on vivEkananda?? what makes you to think that he is not even an
> advaitin!! I've read his work on jnAna yOga, though it is not shAstric &
> rigid in the representation of non-dual phiolosophy, I think, it is worth
> reading for those who persue jnAna mArga. Kindly comment.
For several reasons, theoretical and practical.
On the theoretical side:
As you mention it not "shastric and rigid in the representation of
non-dual philosophy." That's important don't you think!
Both Vivekananda and Ramakrishna (especially the latter) were products of
Bengali culture where the dominant religious strain is vamachari tantrik.
The form of tantra practiced there is advaita but it is not Vedantic.
The problem was that for Victorian era prudes, tantra was too overtly
sexual, superstitious and overall "primitive" Vedanta on the other hand
both had traditional prestige and the admiration of European thinkers.
This explains the mania to rebrand everything as
"Vedanta" If Ramakrishna and Vivekananda had more confidence in their own
culture, then I don't think they would have bothered with that label.
On the practical side:
In the Indian imagination, Vivekananda is the cultural hero who defended
the honor of Indian civilization against Western criticism and in Chicago
took the battle directly to the enemy. I can see how that is attractive.
Perhaps it was even necessary and if there hadn't been a powerful
apologist for Hinduism at that juncture we would all be Christians or
something by now.
Does that mean Vivekananda is necessary now? In my fathers youth one of
the functions of the Ramakrishna mission in his non-descript part of
Gujarat was not just to defend Hinduism (there was no one to defend it
against in that area) but to introduce modern notions to traditionalist
people in a palatable way. The resident swami convinced him to study the
upanishads but also convinced him to study English literature. Today who
needs a swami to explain how to be modern? India has been independent for
60 years. Younger generations don't feel that sense of inferiority and
defensiveness towards the West and they are at home in modernity. In fact
in fields like IT, Indians are helping create the modern world. The other
side of this is that our traditions and texts are also more accessible
than ever before.
The nature of the West has changed too. It is more tolerant now and more
familiar with other cultures. Westerners don't need to have Hinduism
watered down for them. In fact they tend to insist that it is not. Look
at another Bengali import, ISKON. It is much more popular in the west
than the RK mission and that is precisely because it is _less_
But this change is not being propogated in the culture. The acceptence of
Vivekanandas synthesis has had the unfortunate effect of freezing
"modern" Hinduism in the modernity of the 19th century. This is the cause
of the continuing intellectual backwardness of the majority of the Hindu
Well I suppose these views make me one of those condescending people
Gerald talked about :-) but I hasten to add these are my personal views.
If someone feels they have benefitted from Vivekanandas philosophy then
good for them. I would just remind them that they can do better.
Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>
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