[Advaita-l] ***UNCHECKED*** The five pUrva pakshis of vaitathya prakaraNa

[Ravi Kiran]

Namaste Sri Venkatraghavan

Yes, aptly said - TurIyan (non-dual, changeless, causeless, sarva-druk,
basis of the 3 states...) alone, is accepted as the ultimate reality, as
paramArtha satya

Thanks

On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 5:40 PM, Venkatraghavan S <agnimile at gmail.com> wrote:

> Namaste Sri Ravi Kiran,
>
> Yes, I think the portions that you highlighted below are relevant to the
> discussion because the presence of duality in its kAraNa or potential form
> in deep sleep has been quite clearly described, especially in the bhAshya
> to 3.34 यस्मात्सुषुप्ते... अविद्यामोहतमोग्रस्तस्य
> अन्तर्लीनानेकानर्थप्रवृत्तिबीजवासनावत:
>
> However just to clarify, and you may have picked up on this already - I am
> not saying that it is because of prAjna's association with *ignorance* that
> it's view of reality cannot be accepted. It is because any participant in a
> system is only able to vouch for what he experiences in the system. He will
> say what he sees is true and what he does not see is false. So without
> shruti, each of prAjna, taijasA and vishvA are only able to say that their
> prapancha is real and the other two are false. Whereas what mANDUkya is
> saying is that all three prapanchas are mithyA.
>
> In order to objectively describe something, the one describing that thing
> has to be outside it. That is why turIya, who is not associated with either
> the jAgrat, svapna or kAraNa prapanchas and sharIras can objectify them,
> and because he is able to do so, they are all mithyA. दृश्यत्वात्
> मिथ्यात्वं.
>
> Further it is only the seer of all prapanchas that is true. So actually
> the pAdas are not four, there is only one pAda - turIya. That is why in
> mantra 7, turIya is called चतुर्थं "मन्यन्ते" - it is "considered as"
> fourth - it is not really the fourth.
>
> Regards,
> Venkatraghavan
>
> On 4 Nov 2016 12:54 p.m., "Ravi Kiran" <ravikiranm108 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 4, 2016 at 4:11 PM, Venkatraghavan S <agnimile at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Namaste Sri Ravi Kiran,
>>> Because prAjna is still associated with kAraNa sharIra, and therefore
>>> part of kAraNa prapancha. Only from turIya's perspective, which is
>>> completely disassociated from all sharIras, can the judgment be made.
>>>
>>
>> True, I see this aspect further explored in kArika 3.34 to 36 and the
>> relevant bhAshya / tIka.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Venkatraghavan
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 4, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Ravi Kiran <ravikiranm108 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Namaste Sri Venkatraghavan
>>>>
>>>> Therefore any judgment made by either the waker or dreamer
>>>> observer cannot be taken as absolutely true. Hence, Vedanta says that
>>>> the judgment of
>>>> reality by vishvA or taijasA or prAjna is not acceptable.
>>>>
>>>> >> could follow vishvA or taijasA part, in the above line of argument,
>>>> but, why prAjna is unacceptable above?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Nov 4, 2016 at 12:58 AM, Venkatraghavan S via Advaita-l <
>>>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Please find below a link discussing the five pUrva pakshis appearing
>>>>> in the
>>>>> vaitathya prakaraNa.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/46044985/Five%20pUrva%20
>>>>> pakshis%20of%20vaitathya%20prakaraNa.pdf
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Venkatraghavan
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>>