advaita-siddhi 12 (Objection by opponent)

H.B.Dave hbd at DDIT.ERNET.IN
Tue Feb 29 03:18:38 CST 2000

Anand Hudli wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2000 16:57:30 -0600, Ravi <msr at COMCO.COM> wrote:
> >Why not both? I think the opponent does not provide a basis for
> >the argument. And simply dismisses it. Or I do not understand why
> >he objects to this.
> >

>  I have heard this objection from some of my MAdhva friends. In reply,
>  we may say that the analogy of dream and waking states to the waking
>  state and Brahman (the fourth) cannot be carried too far. Every
>  analogy has certain limitations that we need to be aware of. We
>  remember the fact that we dreamed in the waking state because the
>  act of dreaming is an "event" in the time frame of the waking state.
>  That is why we admit the fact of having dreamed, although we do
>  not have to admit the reality of content of the dream.
>  But in the fourth or turIya state of Brahman, even Time vanishes. There
>  can be NO events. So there cannot even be an indication of the fact that
>  a "dream" occurred.
I would not be so sure about Time (refering to the last few lines
I think saying that Time does not exists does not mean that the events
represented by the Time do not exist. The indication that a "dream"
occurred as a past event in Turiya, is there as a "being". Our trouble
is that we are having this discussion while still in the "dream". Can we
percieve in a "dream" how does it feel like to have no "dream-Time"? I
think only answer can be self-experience, (a strict Advaitin would say
there is no experience, because experience presupposes Dvaita,
experiencer, experienced and experience). I would not be able to discuss
that! (yato vacho nivartante ...).
Prof. H.B. Dave
Co-ordinator for Institutional Development
and Professor & Head of Department
Computer Engineering
Dharmsinh Desai Institute of Technology
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NADIAD   387001 (Gujarat) India
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