Study of Vedas

Ashish Chandra ramkisno at HOTMAIL.COM
Sun Apr 14 08:08:29 CDT 2002

On Sat, 13 Apr 2002 13:11:46 -0700, Srikrishna Ghadiyaram
<srikrishna_ghadiyaram at YAHOO.COM> wrote:

>This question is based on your limited interpretation
>of the word Dharma. If your interpretation is the only
>correct one, then what does it mean to say, "Dharmo
>rakshati Rakshitah" ? Should we infer as "Karmo
>Rakshati Rakshitah" ?????

It means that Dharma will protect us only if we protect (follow) dharma.
But why do we need protection from Dharma? To what end is that protection
sought if not liberation, whether we realize it or not? So how can there
still be need for a dharma in a state of liberation, which is the state of
a jivanmukta?

>> As a
>> rhetorical question, we can logically ask whether a
>> Jivanmukta is to follow
>> any dharma. The answer would be no, IMO.
>Again this is based on your limited interpretation. A
>Jivanmukta is always abiding in His Dharma. As a
>rhetorical question, we can logically ask what is the
>Swarupa of a Jivanmukta .

Brahman is the swarupa of a jivanmukta, as it is of you and me. Only
difference is that the Jivanmukta abides in it, is fully absorbed in it.
Does Shankara not ask "Ko Varnaashrami bhavet" of one who has given up all
desire of this world and the next and desires liberation only i.e.
sannyasi? Then how is it logical to ask about a self-evident fact?

>What is the Dharma of Sugar ? What is the Dharma of
>wind ? So, also what is the Dharma of a Being ?
>As sugar can not be without being sweet; as wind can
>not be without motion, and mixed up with the smells it
>carries, a Being can not be without its Being.


>Just as wind carries and remains in motion without
>being tainted with the fragrance it carries, we should
>remain in our Swadharma of Sat-Chit-Ananda Niranjana
>etc.. moving with the worldly duties.

If swadharma be the same as our swarupa, why is it that man should seek
the chaturvidh purushaartha - dharma, artha, kaama and moksha. Since
swadharma *is* moksha, why would it be a separate purushaartha?

>So, please expand your definition of Dharma.

Yo Dhaaryati iti dharma.

>You are so much looking for mechanisms that it will
>require some changed thinking so get away from
>dependence on Karmakanda, in its narrow sense.

Our rishis certainly did not think karmakanda was unavoidable. Saadhana
Chaatushtyam is attained only after sincerely fulfilling one's karmas,
which is going through karmakanda portion of the Veda.

>From ADVAITA-L at LISTS.ADVAITA-VEDANTA.ORG Sun Apr 14 21:03:58 2002
Message-Id: <SUN.14.APR.2002.210358.0700.ADVAITAL at LISTS.ADVAITAVEDANTA.ORG>
Date: Sun, 14 Apr 2002 21:03:58 -0700
Reply-To: List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara
To: List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara
From: ravi chandrasekhara <vadhula at YAHOO.COM>
Subject: Re: Tyagi Braahmans
In-Reply-To: <20020412222133.892EC7FC2 at>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

This is in response to Ashish's question on svadharma
based on his jati (subcaste):

Tyagi Braahmans (according to People of India Series:
Haryana) left puja-path and took to agriculture after
Bhagawan Parashurama destroyed many evil Kshatriyas
and distributed land to the Braahmans, Tyagis left
their traditional occupation to take care of that
land.  But also according to this book, they obviously
have the same gotras as all Braahmans and still wear
the yagnopaveeta (janeu or janoi); hence I would think
they are eligible to perform sandhya-vandana and learn
their saka, even though they may not be vaidiki
Braahmans as far as occupation is concerned.  They are
also traditionally vegetarian.

So when did they give up puja-path ?  Well according
to Hindu Dharma by the former Shanakaracharya of
Kanchi and also by many traditionalists, a mahayuga
(cycle of 4 yugas) is approximately 4.2 million years.
 Bhagawan Parashurama appeared on the 19th Treata Yuga
of this manvantara, hence approx 39 million years ago
by this method of calculation. Well it is probably
best to conclude that Tyagi Brahmins have given up
priesthood for many generations before the advent of
the Mughals.

Now Ashish if your immediate forefathers have given up
the janeu, probably some acharyas could describe
atonements, etc for this lapse based on the
dharmashastras.  But if you have undergone your
upanayana, as per shastras, you should be able to
study your saka.  Some people who be of help include
the elders of your jati, the 4(5) Shankaracharya
peethas in India, or your family prohit. Also there is
an association known as the Brahman Samaj of North
America ( that has Tyagi Braahmans as
members; in addition there is member named Ramanath
Sharma, prof of Sanskrit at Univ of Hawaii, who is a
Kanyakubja Braahman from UP who may also be able to
provide you some info.  The DFW Hindu temple has 3
purohits: Punjabi braahman, Gujarati Braahman, and a
Telugu Braahman from Tamil Nadu; maybe one of them may
be knowledgable in your saka.  There are subcastes of
Braahmans belonging to the Madhyadina saka:
Telugu/Tamil/Kannada Prathamasakis and Madhydina
Braahmans of Maharashtra.

Hope this provides some help,

Ravi Chandrasekhara MD

--- Ashish Chandra <ramkisno at HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
> On Fri, 12 Apr 2002 12:32:33 -0400, Jaldhar H. Vyas
> <jaldhar at BRAINCELLS.COM> wrote:
> >On Thu, 11 Apr 2002, Ashish Chandra wrote:
> >
> >> That is what I was doubting i.e. can swadharma
> and following the lead of
> >> your ancestors the same or do they differ, as
> they most certainly do in
> my
> >> case. Swami Chandrashekharendra Sarasvatiji
> teaches through his book that
> >> we must follow the dharma of our ancestors. So I
> was just thinking that
> >> since Vedas have not been studied in my line for
> quite some time, has my
> >> swadharma changed.
> >
> >This is a dilemmna any ethical person and culture
> has to face.  What do
> >you do when those with responsibility shirk it?
> [...]
> >Do your community believe there was a Brahman ideal
> they have fallen from
> >or do they think there way of life is how they have
> always lived?  That's
> >the central question to ask I think.
> >
> I don't know and I don't think I have spoken to any
> of the elders about
> this. The condition of Brahmins in North India is
> very different from those
> in the South. Here we have become farmers and
> warriors and rarely does one
> come across anyone doing Veda-adhyayan. But anyway,
> I hope I am correct to
> presume that since I have a shakha, I should assume
> that the study of this
> shakha was undertaken by our community a very long
> time ago. In that case,
> I would like to know if there are any teachers of
> Madhyandina Shakha of SYV
> in Dallas/Fort Worth area. I can try and learn at
> least the basic karmas.
> thanks
> ashish

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