liila and celebrating duality

[Somik Raha]

Hello,

    This is a most interesting thread. I just went thru the link posted here
earlier on ajAti vAda. Someone mentioned that ajAti vAda is the "final and
ultimate opinion of learned scholars".

    I've been familiar with this theory though not by its name. Somewhere
down the line, this theory leads me to ask - why is Paramatman fooling
himself (?) to be Jivatman - and refusing to realize it. From the
"standpoint of reality" - if there is no creation, then I am not here
either, and if everything is illusory - then is there any driving force in
this illusive simulation ?

 Where is the cosmic supercomputer located that is creating this virtual
reality :) ? Is it that the Jivatman is driving it thru his own force which
is hardly different from the Paramatman's (as per sRshTi dRshTi vAda) ?

>standpoint of relative
> creation is there
I am confused - relative to what ? And what is reality in the first place ?

Using Maya to explain creation can be counter-productive - reminds me of
Bertrand Russell's view of the priest who said that everything came to be
5000 years ago, even the dinosaurs, et al, with false proof that they are
actually millions of years old. It is just a part of this simulation. To
which Russell's view was that one cant counter this argument even if one
replaced "5000 years" with "5 mins" - there is no way you can prove or
disprove a "perfect simulation" argument. Does this sound parallel to sRshTi
dRshTi vAda (notwithstanding the fact of the discovery in quantum mechanics
mentioned later in the same piece, the argument logically still holds)?

Regards,
Somik

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lalita Iyer" <lalita_iyer at YAHOO.COM>
To: <ADVAITA-L at LISTS.ADVAITA-VEDANTA.ORG>
Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: liila and celebrating duality


> There is no debate on creation being real or not. It
> is very clear that from the standpoint of reality
> there is no creation or anything whatsoever everything
> is appearace and from the standpoint of relative
> creation is there.Lalita
> --- Vidyasankar <vsundaresan at HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
> > >>            gauDapAda kArikA 1-9
> > >>
> > >
> > >This statement is not a sufficient proof to
> > establish
> > >that 'there is no creation'. it only establishes
> > that
> > >'the creation is neither act of lila nor enjoyment
> > for
> > >Lord'. It does say that 'the act of creation is the
> > >nature of God'. So, 'Ceation exists' whatever be
> > the
> > >cause ????
> >
> > I have been keeping out of the Kashmir Saivism
> > thread and
> > this one, for I think it is a never-ending debate. I
> > merely
> > want to point out the mANDUkya statement that the
> > turIya,
> > which is the advaita state, is prapancopaSama and
> > SAnta.
> >
> > Vidyasankar
>
>
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