[Advaita-l] dvaita and advaita on pramA ( Right knowledge)

[Jay Nelamangala]

Dear Naresh,

>On a lighter note, was I the only one who had to go to dictionary.com to
>look up the word 'sublated'? Well, atleast I sublated my ignorance of
>the word 'sublated'! (sorry..I just couldn't resist it.)

Thanks man.   No need to be sorry.  That is a good one.
Atleast my posting helped you learn a new english word :-)
That is the whole point in posting these series.
We all get to know new things, that we did not care about all
these days.
I am also learning some new things about advaita everyday.

>
> Does knowledge apprehend the object or is it the processing element of
> the knowledge, man, who apprehends the object? If two different people
> looking at an object, knowing the same things about the object, can come
> to different conclusions about it, can't they?
>
O Sure.

That is where - the knower, the object that is known and knowledge of that
object,  some call it triputee - or triad of knowledge,  comes into picture.
When the knowledge of that object, reveals that object to the knower,  the
knower comes to know that object.

When that knowledge reveals it as the object is,  then it is true knowledge.
When that knowledge reveals it as some other object,  then it is wrong
knowledge.

Say,  three people look at an object ( say a shell)  and come to
different conclusions - one as silver,  one as diamond,  and another as
shell -
then the first two got wrong knowledge, and third one got correct knowledge.
That is why,  wrong knowledge always comes in many varieties,  and there
can be  only one variety in correct knowledge.

You may ask how come they came to different conclusions?

Under normal conditions they don't.   That is why,  in broad-day light,
a snake is a snake for everyone,  and a rope is a rope for everyone.
When it is dark,  not enough light,  some may percieve rope as snake.

If you are a snake expert,  even when there is not enough light,
still you may see a rope as clearly a rope only,  because you know
the subtle differneces between how a snake curls and a rope curls and
also because you don't get very excited and scared when you see an
actual snake.   So, you will make an attempt to pick it up anyway, and
that is when you will know for sure if it is a snake or not.

That is why,  karma / adhrshTa are included while explaining wrong
knowledge.  'karma'  is what you have been doing all these days in this
life and also in your previous lives.   That is sum total of your
experience.
That is what makes you what you are today,  is'nt it?

If you have been busy with snakes all your life,  then that "karma"
will help you not to get wrong knowledge  easily when you see a rope.
On the other hand, if you have been busy with PCs and keyboards,
then you will easily get that wrong knowledge
when you see a rope in a dimly lit area.

If in your past experience (karma)  you have never seen a diamond,  then
when you see a shining  shell,  there is no possibility of getting the wrong
knowledge that it is a diamond.  So, the thing that you think it is,
must already be in your previous experience.  That is where 'karma' comes
into picture. Then,  there may be many shiny things that  could be in
your prior experience - glass, plastic, aluminium foil, silver etc
Which one of these will you get confused to when you see a shining shell?
That is where adrshTa ( luck) comes into picture.

I hope I answered your question.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Naresh Cuntoor" <cuntoor at glue.umd.edu>
To: "Jay Nelamangala" <jay at r-c-i.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2003 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] dvaita and advaita on pramA ( Right knowledge)


>
> Jay Nelamangala wrote:
>
> > dvaita position is "yathArtham pramANam"  pramA is that knowledge which
> > grasps its object as it is.
> >
>
> Using the snake/rope example. Would the truth be the snake then? Because
> thats whats apparent to the observer.
>
> > advaita position is that :  pramA is the knowledge of an object which
> > is not
> > sublated.
> >
>
> On a lighter note, was I the only one who had to go to dictionary.com to
> look up the word 'sublated'? Well, atleast I sublated my ignorance of
> the word 'sublated'! (sorry..I just couldn't resist it.)
>
> > Further, to explain pramA as yathArtha has no significance in advaita.
> > Advaita believes in two types of objects :  vyAvahArika and
prAtibhAsika.
> >
> > (For those of you who don't know : prAtibhAsika is that which exists
> > only during the time of its apprehension.  Ex: silver superimposed on
> > shell.
> > vyAvahArika is that which is sublated by the knowledge of Brahman,
> > vyAvahArika is empirical and that which is in acoordance with usage)
> >
>
> In other words, vyAvahArika is the objects around us that we percieve as
> physical entities and objects that we sense such as taste etc. Isn't
> that pratibhAsa as well? i.e., their appearance?
>
>
> > It is obvious that no knowledge apprehends its object either as
> > prAtibhAsika or as vyAvahArika and there can be no knowledge that can
> > be regarded as yathArtha.  Further, even granting the validity of the
>
> Does knowledge apprehend the object or is it the processing element of
> the knowledge, man, who apprehends the object? If two different people
> looking at an object, knowing the same things about the object, can come
> to different conclusions about it, can't they?
>
> >
> >
> >
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