Vishnu and Shiva

kalyan chakravarthy kalyan_kc at HOTMAIL.COM
Tue Mar 11 11:29:58 CST 2003


In future I may or may not have time to write so many replies. So I am doing
it right now.

>May that Divine Physician, ***First among gods,***
Either Brahman can be treated as a God or not. If the former, then saying
that Rudra has derived his power from Vishnu is a contradiction. If the
latter, then Brahman is That which is not understood even by the Gods.

>Prostration be to Thee, O Lord, ***Ruler of the

Either the Narayana within Him is being praised. Or, Shiva is identified
with the Praajna quarter of the Mandukya Upanishad. In either case, there is
Narayana or Turiya  which is nirguNa Brahman which is called as the Atman
and thus refers to Narayana.

>mortality, ***Overlord over everyone,*** Bestower of
>Blessedness, Ever-Auspicious,

1.Turiya being auspicious does not eliminate other things from being
auspicious. Thus rudra can also be auspicious.
2.The over lordship can be interpreted as Praajna of the Mandukya Upanishad
and not Turiya.
3. Again talks of blessedness can be interpreted as praajna which is called
as anandamaya and not Turiya.

All this is necessary, otherwise, Rudra cannot derive His power from Vishnu
which means there is a contradiction with the Rig Veda.

>Prostration to the Primeval One and the ***Chief of

Again Praajna and not Turiya.

>is more auspicious than anything else.***

Which in itself shows an indication of duality and Turiya can be safely

At this point I foresee an objection.

Objection-There are many places where Narayana is called as Lord etc. Why
not interpret that as Praajna and not Turiya?

Reply-You can interpret that as Praajna. But also note that Narayana is
called as the Self, which is meaningless if Narayana cannot be said to be

Objection - Why not say Rudra as Turiya?

Reply - Then saying that Rudra derives his power from Vishnu is meaningless.

Best Regards

>From: Rolando Santos <sivadancer at YAHOO.COM>
>Reply-To: List for advaita vedanta as taught by Shri Shankara
>Subject: Re: Vishnu and Shiva
>Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 14:07:03 -0800
>Here are some verses that I found from the Satarudriya
>section of the Yajur Veda. I ***highlighted*** the
>portions that I thought were relevant to this
>discussion. It is also my understanding that the
>Satarudriya is the only portion of the Vedas that is
>written in the namavali format...and it is in praise
>of Rudra (I'm not sure if this is significant).
>I apologize for not including the Sanskrit. The
>translation is by Swami Krishnananda of the Divine
>Life Society.
>May that Divine Physician, ***First among gods,***
>exalt me in His all-redeeming Transcendent Being;
>Prostration be to Thee, O Lord, ***Ruler of the
>universe,*** Great God Three-Eyed One, Destroyer of
>the Tripuras, Death to the destructive Fire of the
>three worlds at the end of Time, Terror to even to the
>terrible Fire of Time, blue-necked one, Overcomer of
>mortality, ***Overlord over everyone,*** Bestower of
>Blessedness, Ever-Auspicious, the Blessed Great God -
>to Thee prostration.
>Prostration to the Primeval One and the ***Chief of
>Prostration to Him who is the source of bliss,
>spiritual as well as temporal; prostration to Him who
>dispenses all happiness, heavenly as well as earthly;
>prostration to Him who is the Auspicious One, ***and
>is more auspicious than anything else.***
>--- kalyan chakravarthy <kalyan_kc at HOTMAIL.COM> wrote:
> > Namaskaar,
> >
> >
> > PS: Please use sruti and not smriti to justify your
> > answers. Thank you.
> >
> > Best Regards
> > Kalyan
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