[Advaita-l] Re: gauDapAda kArikA-s

Vidyasankar Sundaresan svidyasankar at hotmail.com
Wed May 21 12:30:01 CDT 2003

>Even in the vyavahArik sense brahman is never deluded.

In what vyAvahArika sense should one talk of brahman? Yes, you can talk of 
saguNa brahman as being in control of avidyA and not being deluded by it, 
but by the same token, avidyA is postulated before you even start talking of 
anything vyAvahArika. There is dvaita only, and so long as you cling to 
vyavahAra, there is no coming out of dvaita.

>*prakAshAdivannaivam parah*. Your arguments are self-defeating. You are 
>saying - "Mr. X is never really deluded. But delusion is not real. 
>Therefore Mr.X can be called as deluded."

Well, these are not *my* arguments. These are just paraphrases of arguments 
offered by gauDapAda, before Sankara, and sureSvara, after Sankara, as also 
a host of other Advaita philosophers over the centuries.

>One question here. What is the difference betwen saying that brahman is not 
>really deluded and saying that brahman is deluded when you say that 
>delusion itself is unreal?

So, do you want to say that delusion is real?

>>It is only an "as if". On the other hand, if you posit a REAL difference 
>>between jIva and Brahman, in order to say that jIva is deluded but Brahman 
>>is not, then you have to necessarily accept that jIva can never REALLY be 
>This is confusion of vyavahArik and paramArthik satyas. You can

Not at all. There has to be a bridge, a jump, a leap, call it what you will, 
from the vyAvahArika to the pAramArthika, which is what the gauDapAda 
kArikA-s do.

>analyze things only in one direction. From the vyavahArik level to the 
>paramArthik level. It is like saying that time travel in the backward 
>direction is going to produce absurdities such as simultaneous dual 
>existence of a single entity. Thus an analysis from the paramArthik 
>viewpoint involves saying that "All this never really happened" and nothing 
>more, nothing less.

You've got that last part right. There is no bondage, no liberation, no 
seeker of liberation - from the pAramArthika level. This is as per gauDapAda 


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