[Advaita-l] Re: Re: Transformation

[Girish Ramadurgam]

Hi

Firstly, thank you very much for your response. Thanks for making me 
aware that I was actually not differentiating between Karma and Gyana.
You did mention that you were looking for information on Practical 
Advaita, was wondering if you got any kind of material, that closely 
defines it if not a complete book atleast an excerpt.
I am sorry, from next time I shall surely write all information about a 
quote that I use.

You wrote
'The path of GYAna is for sannyAsins'.

Does it means only SannyAsins can achieve moksha? Correct me if I am 
wrong. I always though that Sankara preached that only Gyana yogi can 
achieve moksha or get liberated from the cycle of rebirth.

Best Wishes,
Girish

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>Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: Re: Transformation (S Jayanarayanan)
>   2. thesis on shaivism (ismath ramzy)
>   3. SelfAwareness to SelfRealisation (Girish Ramadurgam)
>   4. RE: thesis on shaivism (Ravishankar Venkatraman)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Tue, 26 Oct 2004 10:07:46 -0700 (PDT)
>From: S Jayanarayanan <sjayana at yahoo.com>
>Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Re: Transformation
>To: advaita-l <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
>Message-ID: <20041026170746.53346.qmail at web50810.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>--- Girish Ramadurgam <rsgirish at aol.com> wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Hi,
>>
>>We did digress on my questions on transformation, behaviour and
>>process.
>>
>>    
>>
>
>Before trying to answer your question, it is fundamental to understand
>the difference between karma (action) and GYAna (wisdom) in the context
>of advaita VedAnta. I hope someone in this list can take the time to
>write up an answer in detail, but in a nutshell, here is something that
>should help: "The Self never acts."
>
>I've been trying to find a website that explains completely the
>*practical* path of advaita VedAnta, but am unable to find one. 
>
>  
>
>>Let me ask a question which is objective -
>>Say there is a Human Being(HB) who earns a decent living and in fact
>>a 
>>bit more than he/she needs which goes into his/her savings. They see 
>>another humanbeing(say beggar) on the pavement who  is dishevelled
>>and 
>>is hungry.
>>--> Should HB help him/her and to what extent.
>>
>>    
>>
>
>The very fact that HB is earning money implies that (s)he believes the
>Self to be something that acts. Since the Self never acts according to
>advaita, the person is ignorant of the nature of the Self. In this
>context, the person ought to live morally. Knowledge of morality
>(dharma) is obtained only from scripture. The karma kANDa portion of
>the Vedas as well as the various smR^itis on dharma ought to be
>followed by the HB. Since the various smR^itis say that people in
>distress ought to be given aid, the HB should give money to the beggar.
>
>  
>
>>Continuing  the question - The excess instead of savings should it go
>>to 
>>help the society?
>>
>>    
>>
>
>If the dharma shAstras say that excess savings should be given to the
>society, it should be done so.
>
>  
>
>>I read in a book about Krishna(might not be the same words),
>>'Anything 
>>in excess is luxury and is not good'. Also read in the same book,
>>where 
>>it mentions 'We should store food which should suffice us for 3 days
>>and 
>>anything more should be distributed'.
>>
>>    
>>
>
>It would be a good idea to provide exact quotes and references.
>
>Ideally, a Brahmin ought to study and abide by the word of the Vedas,
>the Kshatriyas ought to take care of matters of the state, and the
>vaishyas ought to be attached to their trade.
>
>  
>
>>Now I do have savings and i do have food which will last me for 2
>>weeks. 
>>Can I ever be a Janani is if live life like this OR should we give up
>>
>>everything?
>>
>>    
>>
>
>The path of GYAna is for sannyAsins. A sannyAsin is one who has (at
>least to a certain extent) attained moral development of the qualities
>such as vairAgya (dispassion), etc. that are referred to as sAdhana
>chatushhTaya. 
>
>The very fact that you have an occupation in a society, and are talking
>about helping others, implies that you simply should abide by dharma,
>and aim to attain the prerequisites for enquiry into the Self.
>
>  
>
>>------> Q2 ) If no one works then the world comes to a stop. So if I 
>>quit working and go to help society, would i be selfish? As I would
>>be 
>>relying on the fact that the rest of the population will work and the
>>
>>world goes on....
>>
>>    
>>
>
>I don't think any dharma shAstra advises "going to help the society at
>the cost of losing all possessions". Please provide references.
>
>  
>
>>------> As for not able to understand Animals as we are incompetent
>>to 
>>gauge their knowledge. By saying this are we putting ourselves on the
>>
>>same plane as animals. I would say there are millions in world, whom
>>we 
>>can comprehend so can we classify them in a different plane?
>>
>>    
>>
>
>The above question is not clear.
>
>  
>
>>I am not extremely good at writing, at places I might not be clear.
>>
>>Best Wishes,
>>Girish
>>
>>    
>>
>
>-Kartik
>
>
>        
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>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2004 23:40:54 -0700 (PDT)
>From: ismath ramzy <shazi2000srpk at yahoo.com>
>Subject: [Advaita-l] thesis on shaivism
>To: advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
>Message-ID: <20041025064054.16953.qmail at web52408.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>
>Dear Sir
>  
>I am a Sri Lankan student of the department of Comparative Religions, 
>in the International Islamic University, Islamabad, Pakistan. I have 
>completed the required course work of the Masters' programme in the above 
>mentioned department and currently am writing a thesis on "Shaivism: 
>History, dogmas, norms, conducts and sects: A historical and
>  comparative study."
>  
>I am interested in writing on Shaivism for the following reason:
>  
>Shaivism is an unknown entity in the Arab world. The little that is 
>known to Arabs is from translation of general books on Hinduism most of 
>which are written from the westernn perspective of religion. I felt 
>that I should introduce Shaivism in a clear and lucid manner for the 
>Arabic readership.
>  
>Unfortunately I found very few books and documents on Shaivism 
>written by Shaivists in our library. But I am quite keen to introduce 
>Shaivism as Shaivist originally perceive it and believe in it rather than 
>reproducing the western view of things or even   heir methodology. My 
>supervisor and the faculty have advised me to visit Shaivist sights and 
>libraries in India and to spend some time with Tapas and learn from their 
>experiences.
>  
>Having visited your site, I was wondering if it would be possible for 
>you to furnish me with some sources on Shaivism or guide me to a person 
>or institute which could guide me further. I also wanted to enquire 
>whether there is any provision in your university to accommodate 
>researchers if so how could we go about doing it.
>  
>I would greatly appreciate a considerate response from your side.
> 
>  
>  
>Thank you,
>  
>  
>Ismath Ramzy
>  
>Department of Comparative Religions
>  
>International Islamic University
>  
>Islamabad
>  
>Pakistan
>  
>
>
>:
>
>        
>---------------------------------
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>Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
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>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:00:12 +0100
>From: Girish Ramadurgam <rsgirish at aol.com>
>Subject: [Advaita-l] SelfAwareness to SelfRealisation
>To: advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
>Message-ID: <417E586C.1040701 at aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
>Hi,
>
>I remember reading (cant recollect the source) that selfawareness is the 
>first step towards selfrealisation.
>Where
>1) Selfawareness - is accepting the presence of almighty and knowing his 
>qualities and trying to reach him.
>2) Selfrealisation - as in advaita, realising that self is God.
>
>How does a man in state of Selfawareness break the fetters that that 
>'God is another external entity' into 'I am God'?
>Does the knowledge he keep acquiring over the period make him realise or 
>should he have started the journey thinking that one day I will find out 
>'I am God'.
>
>Please correct me where I am wrong and would appreciate your views on 
>the above queries.
>
>Kind Regards,
>Girish
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Tue, 26 Oct 2004 15:43:43 -0400
>From: "Ravishankar Venkatraman" <sunlike at hotmail.com>
>Subject: RE: [Advaita-l] thesis on shaivism
>To: advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
>Message-ID: <BAY22-F27rxxnSYe4nh00011fe5 at hotmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>
>Please visit http://www.himalayanacademy.com and click on publications to 
>find some books on this.  This is one of the Saiva monastries founded in 
>Hawaii by a western Swami, who took to renunciation in Jaffna from a 
>well-known yogi.
>
>Though this has been written by a westerner, I believe that it is rooted in 
>traditional Saivism as practised in the Tamil land.
>
>I hope this helps.
>
>Thanks,
>Ravi
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>>From: ismath ramzy <shazi2000srpk at yahoo.com>
>>Reply-To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta 
>><advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
>>To: advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org
>>Subject: [Advaita-l] thesis on shaivism
>>Date: Sun, 24 Oct 2004 23:40:54 -0700 (PDT)
>>
>>
>>Dear Sir
>>
>>I am a Sri Lankan student of the department of Comparative Religions,
>>in the International Islamic University, Islamabad, Pakistan. I have
>>completed the required course work of the Masters' programme in the above
>>mentioned department and currently am writing a thesis on "Shaivism:
>>History, dogmas, norms, conducts and sects: A historical and
>>  comparative study."
>>
>>I am interested in writing on Shaivism for the following reason:
>>
>>Shaivism is an unknown entity in the Arab world. The little that is
>>known to Arabs is from translation of general books on Hinduism most of
>>which are written from the westernn perspective of religion. I felt
>>that I should introduce Shaivism in a clear and lucid manner for the
>>Arabic readership.
>>
>>Unfortunately I found very few books and documents on Shaivism
>>written by Shaivists in our library. But I am quite keen to introduce
>>Shaivism as Shaivist originally perceive it and believe in it rather than
>>reproducing the western view of things or even   heir methodology. My
>>supervisor and the faculty have advised me to visit Shaivist sights and
>>libraries in India and to spend some time with Tapas and learn from their
>>experiences.
>>
>>Having visited your site, I was wondering if it would be possible for
>>you to furnish me with some sources on Shaivism or guide me to a person
>>or institute which could guide me further. I also wanted to enquire
>>whether there is any provision in your university to accommodate
>>researchers if so how could we go about doing it.
>>
>>I would greatly appreciate a considerate response from your side.
>>
>>
>>
>>Thank you,
>>
>>
>>Ismath Ramzy
>>
>>Department of Comparative Religions
>>
>>International Islamic University
>>
>>Islamabad
>>
>>Pakistan
>>
>>
>>
>>:
>>
>>
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>
>
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