[Advaita-l] RE: janmana jaayate shUdraH

Srikrishna Ghadiyaram srikrishna_ghadiyaram at yahoo.com
Sun Feb 13 01:20:54 CST 2005

hariH Om !!

--- Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar at hotmail.com>

> >Are you saying that all the four castes can undergo
> >upanayana ceremony ? It may so happen that a SUdra
> >wants to undergo upanayana ceremony, and not study
> >vEda like most of the other three castes do. So, we
> >can generalize that upanayana is OK for all the
> four
> >castes, and would you clarify if the all the 4
> castes
> >after upanayana are eligible for all the karma that
> a
> >brAhmaNa is supposed to perform including nitya,
> >naimittika karmas.
> I confess I don't see the rationale behind this line
> of argument. If it is 
> not a person's family custom to undergo an upanayana
> ceremony, why start 
> now, especially if there is no interest in learning
> the veda? And without a 
> modicum of veda study, where is the question of
> nitya or naimittika vaidika 
> karma? My point is this - given an interest and
> sincerity in learning the 
> veda and imbibing the values inculcated in them,
> even if birth makes one a 
> non-dvija, I would say the upanayana saMskAra should
> be done before starting 
> the study of the veda. If there is no interest to
> begin with and if wearing 
> a yajnopavIta is only for show, I don't see any
> point in conducting an 
> upanayana.

I take that, you have answered my main question  which
is whether a SUdra can undergo upanayana and Vedic
studies, as 'YES'. Would you please answer the other
part i.e will such a SUdra be able to do all the nitya
and naimittika karmas just like brAhmanas. 

I am asking these questions because if it is allowed
by all communities to live like a brAhmana, if they
choose,  interms of samskaras and duties then there
should not be any moe complaints. I also know that
once such provision is made available they will not
demand for it, as we see that even brAhmaNas do not do
this unremunirative job any more. Current society has
more attractive things to offer. But, it will quieten
the society. Let a serious brAhmana or other practice
the vedic karma/dharma, as they wish. If the society
allows such activities for all it is likely to remove
unnecessary social divide, as it is perceived now,
though there may not be such a divide in reality.

All the complaints against brAhmanas are not based on
the eligibility for Vedic study etc. It is all
because, once upon a time those roles had more
importance in the society. Mostly it is the problem of
the upper castes not treating all people with due
respect, and arrogating more resources for themselves.
Now that we are in path for a new social order, this
debate about eligibility will be a moot point.

Om Namo Narayanaya !!


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