[Advaita-l] Brahmana or Sudra?

[Satish Arigela]

>"Can someone define the term shUdra first?"
 
 One born to Shudra parents(people of those communities who never had upanayana etc., before in their families) is a Shudra.
 
>Badisa: Namaste. Firstly, if we can define who is brahmana, then every 
>other definition will fall on the line. For this, please refer 
>Vajrasuchika upnishad. This upanishad gives very clear picture who is called a 
>brahmana. This will certainly dispell most of the misunderstandings on 
>this topic.
 
 That upanishad part was already discussed. Please see Shri Ramakrishnan's post.
 
http://escribe.com/religion/advaita/m15950.html
 
Quote from above post:
"Please read the upanishad carefully before thinking it is a social
statement on rituals and karma."
 
No matter what YudhishhThira said, werent men like him and Bhishma for all their "Brahmana like" qualities referred to as Kshatriyas and not as Brahamana-s through out Mahabharata? In addition to that, both of them seem to have followed the Kshatriya dharma and not the dharma of a Brahmana. I am sure one will not find a single instance in Mahabharata where someone born in other varna-s wase considered a Brahmana due to his conduct.
 
From:
http://escribe.com/religion/advaita/m15993.html
 
satya.n dAnaM kShamA shIlamAnR^isha.nsyaM damo ghR^iNA . 
dR^ishyante yatra nAgendra sa brAhmaNa iti smR^itaH .. 16..
 
Bhishma and others had all those qualities.
 
I read only portions of Bharata, so I take this back if something contrary is pointed out in some Parva.
 
Rgds

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