[Advaita-l] Self-knowledge

[Amuthan]

namo nArAyaNAya!

dear shrI satyan chidambaran,

--- Satyan Chidambaran <satyan_c_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
>   An understanding of sleep doesn't require NS. An
> understanding of sleep  just requires one to see
> that the truth of the sruti statements  regarding
> sleep via analysis in the *sUksma buddhi*. 
> 

you have completely missed my point. the topic here is
NOT how we understand sleep, but how the truth taught
in the shruti-s - brahma satyam - is experienced
*during* deep sleep. you earlier asserted that the
knowledge of advaita should be present in *all*
experiences. it is not sufficient to know the truth of
advaita in the waking state alone. unless the
intellect is sharp enough (and that occurs with the
perfection of dhyAna - samAdhi), it is impossible to
intuit the truth of advaita *during* sleep.

(BTW, the question of how we have a knowledge of
sleep, though not related to his topic, is quite
profound. it is possible, as you have elaborated in
your mail, to get a (parokSha) j~nAna of what sleep is
with shAstra dR^iShTi. but an aparokSha j~nAna of deep
sleep is possible only for one who has experienced
nirvikalpaka samAdhi.)
  
--- Satyan Chidambaran <satyan_c_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>   There are two kinds of laya: "bhAva poorvaka laya"
> and "vichAra  poorvaka laya". The former requires a
> physical resolution. The latter  requires a
> resolution by vichAra. This verse doesn't require
> you to  experience the resolution of the mind in the
> buddhi and the buddhi in  mahat using "bhAva
> poorvaka laya". It requires you to see the truth of 
> that vakya with the "subtle intellect" using kArana
> kArya vichAra and  vyashti samashti vichAra which is
> generally outside the scope of this  discussion. 
>

this kAraNa kArya and vyaShTi samaShTi vichAraNA is
done during manana. during nididhyAsana, whatever has
been said in that shruti has to be *done* (and not
just mentally thought of).

--- Satyan Chidambaran <satyan_c_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
>   
>   "Being Hidden in all beings, this Atma is not
> evident. However, it can  be seen by the people of
> subtle vision with a sharp, subtle intellect"
>   
>   The use of "buddhi" isn't coincidental here.
>   

and it is not to be interpreted as normal buddhi
either! the sharp intellect that is referred to here
is the one that has tattva j~nAna as a result of
sattvApatti.

--- Satyan Chidambaran <satyan_c_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
>   
>   The knower of bramhan will never chase NS or any
> experience for that  matter. A sishya in advaita
> vedAnta will also not chase NS because he  need not.
> Why chase something that is neither necessary nor
> sufficient,  especially when he is trying to get
> established in the knowledge that  truth is
> available in all experiences? He would be
> contradicting  himself by chasing a special
> experience.
>

i hope you are not taking the word 'chasing'
literally! please note that to be 'established in the
knowledge that truth is available in all experiences'
is possible only for one who has had a direct
knowledge of brahman. such a one practises the triad
of tattva j~nAna, mano nAsha and vAsanA kShaya in
order to attain jIvanmukti. practising the triad
mentioned above is essentially the same as 'chasing'
nirvikalpaka samAdhi.
    
--- Satyan Chidambaran <satyan_c_at_yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>   I could write a little bit here. However, I can
> direct you to a book  that I think will save me some
> typing because the author has already  done good
> justice. Please see Section 23.
>   
>  
> http://www.katha.org/Academics/Advaita-PT-IIIB.html
>   

according to the description of nididhyAsana given in
the above reference, all the various vR^itti-s of the
mind are controlled with a nirodha vR^itti (AtmAnAtma
viveka) that springs from gurushAstra upadesha. in
case you didn't notice it, this can only end in
samAdhi. the description of nididhyAsana that you have
referred to is perfectly well summarized by the
following sUtra-s of bhagavAn pata~njali,

'tatpratiShedArthamekatattvAbhyAsaH' (1.32)
'to rectify that (in this case, vyAvahArika dR^iShTi),
practise of one subject (in this case, parokSha tattva
j~nAna (= AtmAnAtma viveka) that arises from
gurushAstropadesha) (should be done)

'vyutthAnanirodhasaMskArayorabhibhavaprAdubhavau
nirodhakShaNachittAnvayo nirodha pariNAmaH' (3.9)
'by the elimination of the outgoing tendencies (of the
mind, by means of AtmAnAtma vichAra) and by the rise
(= practise) of the controlling modification of the
mind (which in our case is the indirect knowledge of
the self that arises from gurushAstra upadesha), the
mind, at that moment, is said to be in a controlling
modification (nirodha pariNAma)'

these two adequately summarize the process of
nididhyAsana that you referred to. 

to understand what happens next, consider the
following: if i let go an apple in my hand, it is
bound to fall down. this is a consequence of the law
of gravity. the apple falls down whether you like it
or not :-) similarly, it is a consequence of a (not so
well known) law of nature (pertaining to the mind)
that a mind which is steadily resolved by nirodha
pariNAma attains samAdhi as is evident from the
following yoga sUtra:

'sarvArthataikAgratayoH kShayodayau chittasya
samAdhipariNAmaH' (3.11)
'when the mind is restrained from thinking of various
objects and is concentrated on one object (in other
words, in a mind that is in nirodha pariNAma), in it,
a modification called samAdhi is produced'.

thus, samAdhi is an inevitable consequence of
nididhyAsana. of course, the nature of samAdhi depends
on the particular nature of the nirodha pariNAma.
during samAdhi, the modifications of the mind subside
and so, 'tadA draShTuH svarUpe.avasthAnam' (1.3) - the
self is directly known. after this sattvApatti, the
parokSha j~nAna received from the guru becomes
aparokSha j~nAna.

vAsudevaH sarvaM,
aparyAptAmR^itaH.


		
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