[Advaita-l] Knowledge, renunciation and varNASrama rules

[ravi chandrasekhara]

Dear All,

If non-Dvijas can be formally intiated in to sanyasa ashrama (dharmically speaking), how can they "formally learn upanishads" (as they are anadhikarais) and what rituals can they perform before formal sanyas as it reqiures nitya-karmas specific to dvijas ?  Teaching Gita, Puraanas, essence of upanishads would not be against dharma as it is accepatable for non-Dvijas.  The other issue is that, can non-Dvija sanyasis initiate Dvijas into sanyasa ashrama and give mantra-deeksha to Dvija non-sanyasis ?

I agree with not giving sanyas to one who is not qualified or not ready regardless of gender/varna/jaathi.

IMHO, I think Madhva and Sir-Vaishnava sampradayas have sanyas for non-Dvijas that is different (called Bida-Sanyas ?).  Also I think these sampradayas state moksha-sadhane BEGINS with a Braahmana janma (Does not mean each Braahmana acquires moksha).  Hence this may also explain why non-Dvijas have Brahma-Gyana (not necessarily same as Sanyas) as they have been Braahmanas in prior birth(s).  On the surface this may be "unfair", but souls have "infinite" number of births, hence in the long runs it appears just.  My understanding is that the Alwars were saints but not formal sanyasis and Dharmavyadha, the butcher, had Brahma-Gyana but was not a sanyasi.

Ravi Chandrasekhara