[Advaita-l] Determination of Varna - Focus on Satyakama

Rajaram Venkataramani rajaramvenk at gmail.com
Fri Aug 17 08:29:01 CDT 2012

Please read Sa. Bh. for Ch. Up. 4.4.4. When satyakama expressed his desire
to be his disciple, <quote>Gautama asked, "Of what family are you my boy?"
for a disciple has to be accepted only when his kula nd gotra are fully
known<\quote>  He followed the norm.

Then, though he did not know his kula and gotra, he accepts him as a
brahmana because he did not flinch from truth. <quote> As you have not
flinched from truth, which is the rightful duty of brahmana caste, I accept
you as a Brahmana and am going to initiate you. Fetch fuel, my boy, for the
fire rites". <\quote> (Sa. Bh. Ch. Up. 4.4.5). This is not the norm but an
exception made based on guna.

In 4.4.5., he presumes his brahmana varna based on the fact satyakama did
not flinch from truth. This is enough to establish that exceptions were and
can be made by competent authorities. We can check the correctness of the
above position with Sringeri Acharya on this. If he says this is not a case
of exception, I will accept exception is not the traditional position. But
if he says exception is allowed, then you should be willing to change your
position. It is an open challenge.

Current jAtis have changed varna as evident from history. If one says that
jAti is the only way to determine varna, then jyotisha sastras should not
provide rules for that. It was used in the case of Shivaji. Karna was
recognised as a kshatriya long before his parentage was known.

On Fri, Aug 17, 2012 at 1:58 PM, Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>wrote:

> On Fri, 17 Aug 2012, rajaramvenk at gmail.com wrote:
>  Can you please tell the group based on Sankara Bhashya, how satyakama's
>> varna was determined?
> This was already covered in one of the first messages on this thread.
> Please read again with an open mind to understand rather than defend your
>> position.
> Hah!  You are the one on a fishing expedition.  Why don't you explain how
> finding varna by horoscope is justified by bhashyas, acharyas etc.
> Preferably somewhere else as now even I've lost my patience long after
> other readers think I should have given up.
> --
> Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>
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