[Advaita-l] kratu without IshvarapraNidhAna

[Rajaram Venkataramani]

On Tuesday, March 20, 2012, Ramesh Krishnamurthy <rkmurthy at gmail.com> wrote:
> Namaste,
>
> On 19 March 2012 22:27, Ramakrishna Upadrasta <uramakrishna at gmail.com>
wrote:
>> One aspect in the recent upAsana/bhakti threads was the effort build
>> an upAsana theory independent of IshvarapraNidhAna. The reasoning
>> adopted seemed rather strange as well: since traditions X, Y, Z which
>> have nothing in common adopt the same techniques yielding similar
>> results, all the way having dissimilar epistemologies, the method's
>> efficacy and results are independent of Ishvara!
>
> I think the issue is being misunderstood. In fact some other
> respondents also misunderstood the issue. The core point is that the
> mantra prayoga's ability to yield a result is dependent on correction
> execution of the process and not on any theoretical constructs or
> concepts one accepts. For example, lets say there are two persons P
> and Q who come from different saMpradAya-s.
>
> P: Ishvara is karma-phala-dAtA.
> Q: Ishvara is not karma-phala-dAtA
>
> Now, even though P and Q have different conceptions of Ishvara, if
> they execute the same prayoga in the same manner and under the same
> conditions, they will get the same result. P may still maintain that
> the phala was given by Ishvara to both P and Q, and Q may have a
> different opinion, but this is orthogonal to the the execution of the
> prayoga and the receipt of its phala.
>
> The upAsaka may be an advaitin, a pUrvamImAMsaka, a
> shaiva/shAkta/vaiShNava tAntrika, a bauddha or a jaina - but as long
> as he executes a given prayoga in the correct way, he will get the
> same result. Of course, things are a little more complex than what is
> stated above, but the general idea should be clear.
>
> So the point being made is not that the results are "independent of
> Ishvara", but that they are independent of the theoretical constructs
> one accepts.
> _______________________________________________
If this is right, then the action done with right knowledge will yield the
same result as action done in ignorance. Lord Krishna says I give the
results.