[Advaita-l] Eternal Loka

[Rajaram Venkataramani]

On Sun, Aug 11, 2013 at 3:27 AM, V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Sat, Aug 10, 2013 at 9:52 PM, Rajaram Venkataramani <
> rajaramvenk at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >  Where does Appayya Dikshitar say that this Vaikuntha or Vishnu is
> > non-eternal? If Ishwara is a concept, so are all vyavahara satyams.
> >
>
> This must be in reference to the Brahma sutra of the fourth chapter.  4.4.5
> gives Jaimini's view which appears to be alluded to by Appayya Dikshitar.
> 4.4.6 gives the view of auDulomi that opposes Jaimini's. In 4.4.7
> bAdarAyaNa the author of the brahma sutras settles the issue by accepting
> both Jaimini's and auDulomi's views as admissible from the vyavaharika and
> pAramarthika viewpoints.  Pl. see the shankara bhashyam for this.
>
> RV: I am afraid that this is an incorrect inference from the bhashyam.
>From a vyavahara perpective, you do not consider an atma jnani to be one
with Ishwara as it tantamounts to superimposing on him characterisitcs of
Ishwara. From a paramartika point of view, you dont have either bondage or
liberation.

> Appayya Dikshita in his nayamanjari (the fourth metrical work delineating
> the various adhikaraNa-s of the brahma sutras from the four schools' points
> of view: dvaita, VA, shivaVA and Advaita, condenses the above adhikaraNa
> called 'brAhmAdhikaraNam' in two simple verses, as stated by me above.
> Thus the 'assertion' by Dikshitar is only the alluding to the Jaimini's
> (vyAvahArika) view and NOT the paramarthika vedantic position.   If you
> recall, during our joint session with Sri Mani Dravid SastriNaH on skype
> you raised this topic and he referred to this adhikaraNam of the BSB.
>
RV: In Siddhantalesa Sangraha, Appayya Dikshitar  takes up the question
whether a mukta attains oneness with Parameshwara or Nirguna Brahman. He
says that a jiva attains oneness with Ishwara and not Nirguna Brahman. He
explains that a jIvA is a reflection of Ishwara and is non-different from
Ishwara because (in pratibimba vAdA) bimba and pratibimba are identical.
When a jIvA gets liberated, the mirror of ajnAna(sthula and sukshuma
sarira) pertaining to that jIva is destroyed but the jIvA continues to
exist as Ishwara. Until all jIvAs get liberated, which will happen after
infinite time or in other words never, Ishwara will continue to exist as
their bimba. Therefore no jIvA can attain the ultimate salvation when the
world is totally dissolved until all jIvas are liberated. Hence the term
"sarva mukti". The same sthula sarira does not return for any one. The
sukshuma sarira does not return for a jnani. But even a jnani remains
forever in the memory, if we can call it that, of the omniscient Ishwara.

I had a follow up discussion with Sri Mani Dravid Sastrigal to confirm the
understanding. If you think I misunderstood, we can have a joint call.

>
> vs
>
>
> > As to the significance of all these vyavahara realities for a vedantins,
> a
> > mukta becomes this Ishwara. As you must know, Appayya Dikshitar takes up
> > the question of whether a mukta becomes Parabrahman or this Ishwara and
> > asserts that he becomes Ishwara.
> >
> >
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