[Advaita-l] Desire, Jnana and Moksha

[rajaramvenk at gmail.com]

Dear Shri Chandramouli, why three conditions should be satisfied? If ajnana is removed, then he is a mukta. The very fact he lives on makes him a jivan mukta. Isn't this alone enough? For the mind to relish brahma jnanam, however, we need mano-nasa and vasana-kshaya. My understanding of mano-nasa is that when I see a pot, I see it for what it really is - all blissful brahman non-different my self -  instead of letting the mind undergo modification in the form of the pot or in other words I don't see it. My understanding of vasana kshaya is I'm  clear of impressions from past experiences of the pot and there's no internal absorption in the pot. These two are dependent on control of the mind not the rise of knowledge itself. Is it not?

Dear Shri Nitin, the bad qualities will be gone even when one has perfected naishkamya karma. He is simply interested in executing his svadharma. It will also be gone when one perform bhakti as his activities are done only for the Lord. The rise of jnana is not dependent on perfection in karma or bhakti though they help to make the mind pure. It is simply dependent on the instruction of maha vakyas and its absorption. Is it not? It may still leave the mind functional with its good and bad qualities if it was not controlled. Is it not?
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-----Original Message-----
From: Nithin Sridhar <sridhar.nithin at gmail.com>
Sender: "Advaita-l" <advaita-l-bounces at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2013 21:20:46 
To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta<advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
Reply-To: A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta
 <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Desire, Jnana and Moksha

I agree with Venkatesh Murthy. Even Sureshwaracharya in his Naishkarmya
Siddhi clearly says a Jivanmukta is devoid of desires, anger etc

-Nithin


On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 8:49 PM, Venkatesh Murthy <vmurthy36 at gmail.com>wrote:

> Namaste
>
> The Jivanmukti being described by some members in this Advaita group is
> against Krishna's teachings in the Gita.
>
> In the fifth chapter shlokas below Krishna  has very clearly given the
> picture of Jivanmukta. He must have controlled anger and desire. He is
> yukta and sukhee. He is Jivanmukta. He goes to Brahma Nirvana. He becomes
> liberated. But members here are saying the Jivanmukta can have desires and
> anger and greed and other bad qualities. We can conveniently say they are
> all Prarabdha and he can enjoy Jivanmukti. This is not correct.
>
> shak{}notiihaiva yaH soDhuM praak{}shariiravimokshaNaat.h .
> kaamakrodhodbhavaM vegaM sa yuk{}taH sa sukhii naraH .. 5\.23..
>
> yo.antaHsukho.antaraaraamastathaantarjyotireva yaH .
> sa yogii brahmanirvaaNaM brahmabhuuto.adhigach{}chhati .. 5\.24..
>
> labhante brahmanirvaaNamR^ishhayaH kshiiNakalmashhaaH .
> chhinnadvaidhaa yataatmaanaH sarvabhuutahite rataaH .. 5\.25..
>
> kaamakrodhaviyuk{}taanaa.n yatiinaa.n yatachetasaam.h .
> abhito brahmanirvaaNaM vartate viditaatmanaam.h .. 5\.26..
>
> sparshaankR^itvaa bahirbaahyaa.nshchakshushchaivaantare bhruvoH .
> praaNaapaanau samau kR^itvaa naasaabhyantarachaariNau .. 5\.27..
>
> yatendriyamanobuddhirmunirmokshaparaayaNaH .
> vigatech{}chhaabhayakrodho yaH sadaa muk{}ta eva saH .. 5\.28..
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 11:36 AM, H S Chandramouli
> <hschandramouli at gmail.com>wrote:
>
> > H S CHANDRAMOULI
> >
> > Dear Sri Rajaramji,
> >
> > The answer to your question based on Jivanmuktiviveka by Sri Vidyaranya
> is
> > as follows
> >
> > For one to become a Jivanmukta, three conditions have to be satisfied
> > namely attainment of jnana, manonasha and vasanakshya. But for liberation
> > and absence of rebirth attainment of jnana alone is sufficient. It may be
> > pertinent to point out that there are other views amongst advaitins on
> the
> > question of when a person becomes a Jivanmukta. Many are of the view that
> > on attainment of jnana itself a person becomes a jivanmukta. However
> there
> > are no differences concerning rebirth. attainment of jnana alone is
> > sufficient for escaping from rebirth.
> >
> > When Ajnana is destroyed , Jnana automatically without any further effort
> > as it is Swayamprakashah. This also leads to destruction of all sanchita
> > and agami karma phalas. But prarabdha karma phala can be exhausted only
> by
> > experiencing it. Hence the body continues to function. Dependimg on the
> > sadhanas carriedout prior to jnana it is posssible that the other two
> > attributes namely mano nasha and vasanakshaya might not have taken place.
> > For this further nishtha in brahman is needed. After these two are also
> > achieved he becomes a jivanmukta in this body itself.. However even
> without
> > these there is no rebirth for one who has attained jnana. Once the
> current
> > body dies, there is no further bodies to be taken.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 12:32 PM, <rajaramvenk at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hare Krishna! It is said that jnAna is the sole cause of liberation
> but a
> > > jnani need not have gone through total mano nasa and vasana kshaya. It
> is
> > > said some jnanis don't even sublate kama, krodha etc. If there are
> > desires
> > > are left in the mind, won't the sukshuma sarira go in to a new body to
> > > enjoy that? How can there be moksha?
> > > Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device
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>
>
> --
> Regards
>
> -Venkatesh
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