[Advaita-l] [advaitin] Seeking clarification on Bri. Up. Mantra 1-4-2

[H S Chandramouli]

<<   if he has the knowledge of oneness, why was he born and if so that
knowledge become useless to eliminate the janamas in the future. The
objection raised was valid one. >>

I tried once again to understand the issue. When the jiva is born as Viraj,
he did not have the knowledge of oneness with Atman.That is why he is born
again.  On reflection he gets this knowledge , but in this janma after
being born as Viraj. Rest follows.

Regards


On Sun, Apr 20, 2014 at 3:54 PM, kuntimaddi sadananda <
kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Chandramouliji - PraNAms
>
> Thanks for taking time to explain. If I may request, you can address me
> just as sada or sadananda since that is the given name, while kuntimaddi is
> my village name where my fore fathers settled. It is not important but just
> for info.
>
> 1. The explanation appears to be valid, except for the fact that our
> understanding (at least mine) is once one has gained knowledge of oneness,
> the aagaami and sanchita are burned out by jnaanam and praarabda is for the
> current BMI and when the current BMI drops there is no further karma to
> propel the next birth.
>
> 2. If  in the previous janma, even if had the desire to become viraj and
> did the requisite upaasana, once one has gained the knowledge of oneness,
> the desire gets sublimated in that jnanam since there is nothing other than
> oneself- just as he asks where is there to be afraid of since he has
> understood oneness, what is there to be desired for also has to come for a
> jnaani - prajahaati yadaakaamaan sarvan partha monogataan. Just as Krishna
> says - these actions of mine do not bind me, even though they are propelled
> by desires to establish dharma and remove adharma.
>
> Here is the possibility that I think more consistent with the rebirth and
> at the same time having some knowledge of oneness.
> ---------
>  He has partial knowledge and not complete knowledge of absolute - as in
> understanding only the twam padartham and not- tat and asi parts -as in the
> simple enquiry of who am I - I am the only subject and everything else is
> object of my cognition. This is what direct method people do claiming that
> there is no need of scriptural study; and also some disciples of Ramana
> Maharshi who think all one has to do is just sit down and do who am I
> inquiry.
>
> The fact that that jiiva took birth as viraj has to imply that he did not
> have the complete knowledge of aham brahmaasmi since he was lonely and
> wanted a company of other jiivas for his happiness as the Upanishad
> describes in subsequent mantras. Therefore he created his wife, etc.
>
> The question I was posing also is Shankara's explanation in relation the
> objection he himself raised in his bhaashya in terms of how he got the
> knowledge and even  if he has the knowledge of oneness, why was he born and
> if so that knowledge become useless to eliminate the janamas in the future.
> The objection raised was valid one.
>
> My specific concern  was I found that the elaborate response to that
> objection did not address the question, as I understood, unless I missed
> something in that explanation - hence seeking clarification.
>
> I could explain by the simple fact that his knowledge was incomplete and
> hence he is born with that partial knowledge- reminds me of jadabharata
> story.
>
> Hari Om!
> Sadananda
>
>
>
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