[Advaita-l] Jiiva at Satya Loka - Will He or Won't He come back

[H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l]

Sri Jaladhar Vyas wrote  << On Thu, 29 May 2014, H S Chandramouli via
Advaita-l wrote:

[full quotes from ratnaprabha and bhashya snipped for brevity.]


The Bhashyam concludes << But nonreturn stands as an accomplished fact for
those from whom the darkness ( of ignorance ) has been completely removed
as a result of their full illumination and who therefore cling to that
liberation as their highest goal which exists ever as an already
established fact. The nonreturn of those who take refuge in the qualified
Brahman becomes a fact only because they too have that unconditional
Brahman as their ultimate resort >> .

It is thus seen that nonreturn from Brahmaloka is guaranteed to all the
aspirants who have reached that loka. I presume my understanding of the
Bhashya is correct.

It is.  The key phrase to note is that aspirants are those "who have that
unconditional Brahman as their ultimate resort."


Is Ratnaprabha considered to be consistent with the
Bhashya in all respects or does it represent independent views which could
also contradict the Bhashya as it considers necessary? Are there any other
commentaries on the Bhashya which differ fro Ratnaprabha?

I can't answer that question in total but here atleast I don't think there
is any inconsistency between the ratnaprabha and the bhashya itself. >>.

Actually when I posted the above mail , I was looking for a Bhashya
authority itself ( and not from other commentaries like Ratnaprabha or
commentators ) for concluding that some jivas who go to brahmaloka do
indeed return from there at some point of time. I was not looking for an
inferential understanding of the issue either. This was provided by Sri
Subrahmanianji subsequently in this thread itself by way of the BUB 6-2-15
wherein Bhashya itself takesup this issue as a question and answer , and
asserts that some of these jivas do indeed return to samsara in due course
of time. With that my question is answered positively.

Regards


On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 10:46 AM, Jaldhar H. Vyas via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> On Thu, 29 May 2014, H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l wrote:
>
> [full quotes from ratnaprabha and bhashya snipped for brevity.]
>
>
>  The Bhashyam concludes << But nonreturn stands as an accomplished fact for
>> those from whom the darkness ( of ignorance ) has been completely removed
>> as a result of their full illumination and who therefore cling to that
>> liberation as their highest goal which exists ever as an already
>> established fact. The nonreturn of those who take refuge in the qualified
>> Brahman becomes a fact only because they too have that unconditional
>> Brahman as their ultimate resort >> .
>>
>> It is thus seen that nonreturn from Brahmaloka is guaranteed to all the
>> aspirants who have reached that loka. I presume my understanding of the
>> Bhashya is correct.
>>
>
> It is.  The key phrase to note is that aspirants are those "who have that
> unconditional Brahman as their ultimate resort."
>
>
>  Is Ratnaprabha considered to be consistent with the
>> Bhashya in all respects or does it represent independent views which could
>> also contradict the Bhashya as it considers necessary? Are there any other
>> commentaries on the Bhashya which differ fro Ratnaprabha?
>>
>
> I can't answer that question in total but here atleast I don't think there
> is any inconsistency between the ratnaprabha and the bhashya itself.
>
> First we must understand the nature of upasana.  Upasana can be be of two
> types.  The first is as an anga of karma. An example of this is the
> meditations that take place during the ashvamedha. Or the panchagnividya.
>  For the mimamsakas all upasanas are of the first type. As such the purpose
> of such upasanas is the procurement of some desired object such as in this
> case residence in brahmaloka.
>
> Vedanta on the other hand says there is a second type which can be an anga
> of jnana.  Most sampradayas consider it to have an aspect of karma as well
> but Advaita Vedantins believe karma can be renounced altogether and upasana
> can be done for jnana alone.  However we do not deny the existence of the
> first type.
>
> (Also some later thinkers have considered upasana as an end in itself
> alongside karma and jnana but that is not the mainstream Advaitic view.)
>
> Thus the presence of a jiva in brahmaloka can be for two different reasons
> and it is not unreasonable that therefore there can be two different
> outcomes.
>
> Here's an analogy I like.  One can visit the campus of Harvard university
> and one can matriculate as a student there.  In both cases it can be said,
> "I went to Harvard" but it means two different things right?
>
>
> On Wed, 28 May 2014, Sunil Bhattacharjya wrote:
>
>  Ravana was a fallen soul Despite having Saarupya Mukti and living near
>> Lord
>> Vishnu he had to take birth on the Earth. Because of his ego he was
>> condemned to take birth on the Earth.
>>
>
> As you say, "Because of his ego."  Cessation of desire is the heart of
> Advaitic upasana and only that will guarantee non-return to samsara.
>
>
> On Thu, 29 May 2014, Venkata sriram P via Advaita-l wrote:
>
>
>> Can we infer upAsana is better than vaidika karma kANDa like agnihotra
>> etc ?
>>
>>
> The only truthful answer is : it depends on the situation.  For the one
> who has developed a distate for these worlds filled with avidya and dukha,
> to withdraw from karma (which it should again be stressed is more than just
> the vaidika karma kanda) is the laudable goal.  But for "he who wishes to
> live here for a hundred years" as the Ishopanishad states, it is karma yoga
> -- karma without interest in its results -- which is superior. That's why
> Gita 2.20 says karmaNaiva hi saMsiddhim AsthitA janakAdayaH "By karma alone
> did Janaka etc. achieve success.  Janaka, the ruler of a large and powerful
> empire could not in his circumstances perform upasana with vairagya but due
> to his generous dana etc. he merited the birth of Janaki and instruction
> from illustrious sages like Yajnavalkya which eventually led to him
> receiving jnana.
>
> And finally note that Krishna Bhagavans exhortation to Arjuna is not to
> meditate but to fight.
>
>
> --
> Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>
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