[Advaita-l] Nyaya Sudha Objections 1

[Durga Prasad Janaswamy]

Hari Om,
Namaste.

"If 'I' has Mukhyartha as Brahman every man, woman and child already has
knowledge (say, realization) of Brahman."  >> Yes, this is correct. But
people are ignorant of it.

"No need to study Sastra to know Brahman. Why study?" >> to remove this
ignorance.

regards


On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 6:42 PM, Venkatesh Murthy <vmurthy36 at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Namaste
>
> But here the Mukhyartha of 'I' cannot be Brahman. If 'I' has
> Mukhyartha as Brahman every man, woman and child already has knowledge
> of Brahman. No need to study Sastra to know Brahman. Why study?
>
> On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 2:54 AM, Durga Prasad Janaswamy via Advaita-l
> <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> > Hari Om,
> > Namaste.
> >
> > Sorry, my earlier email has typos.  I am correcting it now.
> >
> > आत्मा is अकाट्य प्रमाण for ब्रह्म
> >
> > aatmaa is akATya pramANa for Brahma.
> >
> > Regards
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 10:10 AM, Durga Prasad Janaswamy <
> janaswami at gmail.com
> >> wrote:
> >
> >> Hari Om
> >> Namaste.
> >>
> >> aatmaa is akaTya pramaNa for Brahma.
> >>
> >> Everyone knows that  I exist.  No one experiences the absence of self.
> >>
> >> regards
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 9:07 AM, Aurobind Padiyath via Advaita-l <
> >> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Namaste
> >>> " Madhva reject that position and argues that unless at least a single
> >>> word
> >>> denotes an object (of knowledge) in its primary meaning, that same
> object
> >>> cannot be target for secondary meaning of other words." That may be
> valid
> >>> only in the case of an object other than the subject. For indicating
> the
> >>> subject which is subject of all things that is not valid.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Aurobind Padiyath
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, 8 Feb 2016 22:22 Srinath Vedagarbha via Advaita-l <
> >>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > 2016-02-08 5:09 GMT-05:00 V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <
> >>> > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>:
> >>> >
> >>> > > On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 11:52 AM, Venkatesh Murthy via Advaita-l <
> >>> > > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >>> > >
> >>> > > >  Namaste
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > DR. B.N.K. Sharma has written a condensed translation of Nyaya
> Sudha
> >>> > > > in English.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > We can discuss the objections of the Teeka Raayaru Jayatirtha and
> >>> see
> >>> > > > if his objections against Advaita are legitimate. Is he correctly
> >>> > > > understanding Advaitis or simply finding faults?
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Dvaitis think if a person has studied Nyaya Sudha he is a Dvaita
> >>> > > > Pandita. This is the best book from the Dvaitis side.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > First Adhyaya of Brahma Sutras is Samanvaya. Samanvaya is all
> >>> > > > Upanishads are logically connected and describing Brahman only.
> Not
> >>> > > > some other thing.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Here there is one objection.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > > Advaitis say Brahman cannot be expressed in words. If Brahman is
> >>> > > > Avacya means cannot be expressed in words how can you talk about
> >>> > > > Samanvaya of Srutis. You yourself said even Sruti cannot express
> >>> > > > Brahman.
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Advaitins do not say that the Shrutis or words do not at all
> express
> >>> > > Brahman.  They admit that Brahman is taught by the means of lakṣaṇā
> >>> vṛtti
> >>> > > by the Shruti/words. There is no rule that a word should convey an
> >>> object
> >>> > > only through vāchya; it can be lakṣaṇayā too. This is acceptable to
> >>> all
> >>> > > shāstras. If this is not admitted no vyvahara can take place.
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>> > To represent pUrvapaxa correctly -- dvaitins are not saying you
> cannot
> >>> > use lakshyArtha at all. What they are saying is that unless a
> vasthu( or
> >>> > viShaya of vAk) has known through its mukhyArtha, the same vastu
> cannot
> >>> be
> >>> > subject of lakshyArtha at all.
> >>> >
> >>> > In the sentence ‘gangayAm gOShaH’ (village is in Ganga), the term
> >>> ‘ganga’
> >>> > must be understood as in secondary meaning (lakshyArtha) as the
> village
> >>> is
> >>> > on the “bank” of ganga. Here the term “ganaga” indirectly indicating
> the
> >>> > bank of the river ganaga.
> >>> >
> >>> > Whereas in the sentence ‘gangyAm mInaH’ (fish in ganga), the same
> term
> >>> > ‘ganga’ must be understood in primary meaning (mukhyArtha) of the
> “the
> >>> > river Ganga”. Why? Because fishes are admitted to be in the river and
> >>> not
> >>> > on the bank.
> >>> >
> >>> > Advaita says there is no words who’s primary meaning denotes Brahman.
> >>> ALL
> >>> > words only in their secondary meaning indicate Brahman (i.e.
> >>> > indirectly/lakshANavritti denote Brahman).
> >>> >
> >>> > Madhva reject that position and argues that unless at least a single
> >>> word
> >>> > denotes an object (of knowledge) in its primary meaning, that same
> >>> object
> >>> > cannot be target for secondary meaning of other words. In the above
> >>> example
> >>> > – unless the object “river bank” is denoted by word “bank” in its
> >>> primary
> >>> > meaning, it cannot be target of indirect/secondary meaning of the
> word
> >>> > “ganga” in “gangayAm gOShaH”. Similarly, unless object of our
> knowledge
> >>> > brahman, in Advaitic assertion “brahman is avAchya” etc, cannot be
> >>> known at
> >>> > all if all words denote in secondary meaning only.
> >>> >
> >>> > /SV
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> >>> --
> >>>
> >>> Aurobind Padiyath
> >>> +91-9689755499
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> --
> Regards
>
> -Venkatesh
>