[Advaita-l] sushupati anubhava of jnAni and ajnAni

[Aurobind Padiyath]

Dear Rajeshji,
Your question
"but this jnAnam take place in
antahkAraNam which can develop
again the
association with the body mind complex somehow, OR it can
not
this is the question to ponder upon."

This question doesn't have validity in the state of Janani "Janathe dvaitam
na vidhyate ". Your Austin can come up only when there is Ajnana.
Janana and Ajanana or Vidya and Avidya are like light and darkness. Even
though opposing in nature, once light illumine darkness vanishes (often
explained as destroyed which is not correct as a thing has to be a vastu to
be destroyed but darkness is not a vastu but absence of light) That
darkness is both existing and non - existing. Existing because it gives
rise to misapprehension and nonexistent as the vastu it cannot be
described. This light of knowledge once dawns, all misapprehensions that
the absence of right knowledge created cannot come back.
Regards,
Aurobind Padiyath



On Sat, 16 Jan 2016 11:59 kuntimaddi sadananda via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Rajeshji - PraNAms
>
> I though I answered the question - Jnaani does not need or cannot sleep
> sleep since jnanam involves recognition that I am Brahman, aham braahmaasmi
> - and scripture says knower of Brahman becomes Brahman; Brahman being
> Brahman need not and cannot also sleep. His BMI need to sleep since it gets
> tired.
>
> anjaani also need not and cannot sleep being Brahmnan; but in his case he
> thinks he needs to sleep and he thinks he slept also by taadaatmyam or
> identification with the BMI as I am this BMI.
>
> Hence the difference between jnaani and ajnaani is only that jnaani knows
> that he is not BMI - they are in him but he is not BMI. Hence one can even
> say - He sleeps and yet he does not sleep. It is not a contradiction - just
> as Krishna say- mastaani sarva bhuutani and in the very next sloka he says
> - na cha mastaani bhuutani. Both are correct - the reference state for each
> statement is only different. Hence jnaani sleep and yet jnaani does not
> sleep - That is his Vibhuti. - pasyan me yogamaiswaram!
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Hari Om!
> Sadananda
>
> If you read my original response this was stated so.
>
>
> --------------------------------------------
> On Fri, 1/15/16, Rajesh Benjwal via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
>  Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] sushupati anubhava of jnAni and ajnAni
>  To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
>  Date: Friday, January 15, 2016, 11:11 PM
>
>  Namaste,
>
>  Lets take few points from
>  various replies.
>
>
>  >>>
>  ​
>  kuntimaddi sadananda
>  ​ji
>  said​
>
>  *>>>>*First answer is - a jnaani
>  does not sleep since he has realized his
>  true nature - brahma vit brahmaiva bhavati - is
>  the scriptural statement.
>  Hence being
>  Brahman he cannot or need not sleep!*>>>*
>
>
>  I do not see
>  any reason why jnAni need not to sleep as this is
>  actually
>  body which needs to sleep. What is
>  the difference between jnAnai and ajnAni
>  body? Why one needs to sleep and other not?
>
>
>
>  >>>> Venkatraghavan Sji said
>  1) ShAstra pramANa is pretty categorical that
>  there is no return for a
>  brahma jnAni. The
>  famously laconic Brahma SUtra, goes to the extent of
>  repeating अनावृत्तिः
>  शब्दादनावृत्तिः
>  शब्दात्,  ("there is no return, says
>  the Shruti"). There are various
>  श्रुति प्रमाण for this:
>  a)
>  तयोर्ध्वमायन्नमृतत्वमेति
>  (Ch 8.6.6, "Going up by that way, one attains
>  immortality")
>  b)
>  एतेन प्रतिपद्यमाना
>  इमं मानवमावर्तं
>  नावर्तन्ते
>  नावर्तन्ते (Ch 4.15.5,
>  "Those who proceed on that path do not
>  return to the life of man"
>  c)
>  तेषां न पुनरावृत्तिः (Br
>  6.2.15, "There is no return for them")
>
>  2) Secondly, by
>  युक्ति प्रमाण, the body's
>  प्रारब्ध would have to be very
>  good if brahma jnAna is attained in the first
>  place. If not, how else would
>  the
>  jnAni's BMI have attained ब्रह्म
>  ज्ञानं and become a ब्रह्म
>  निष्ठ in
>  that janma? That being
>  the case, how can his प्रारब्ध have a lapse,
>  after
>  attainment?
>  >>>>>>
>
>
>  Correct, but there is one
>  exception also, which is a rare one, that if some
>  take birth with such prArabdha which cannot be
>  exhausted in one janma then
>  that jnAni,
>  of-course talking about the sukshma sarira of jnAni, will
>  again
>  get a sthula sarira. So exceptions are
>  there.
>
>
>  >>>If concerns still remain that one
>  is not a brahma nishTHA and hence may
>  lapse,
>  Krishna in Chapter 6 of the Gita says that if such a lapse
>  happens,
>  that person will be born in an
>  environment conducive for ज्ञान योग in
>  the
>  next birth and will carry on from where
>  he left off in the previous
>  birth.>>>
>
>  Perfect. :-)
>
>
>
>  >>>>>> Aurobind Padiyathji
>  said
>  A wave when it merges back to ocean it
>  fears not that it will become a wave
>  again.
>  Because it has lost the individuality of the wave. But the
>  waves
>  keep coming and merges back in the
>  same fashion again and again. But those
>  waves have the firm knowledge that is not a
>  simple wave but the mighty
>  ocean.
>  Similarly when That knowledge arises there is
>  no more fear of what is not
>  real. To such a
>  person there is nothing other than That. For him, the one
>  who had gained that knowledge, everything is
>  only That where even names and
>  forms are
>  mere appearances of That, which is nothing but his own
>  nature.
>  To such a person which is everything
>  and sees only his own nature where can
>  he
>  look and what can he see other than his own nature.
>  The only example the Veda uses to explain that
>  state is "like" the deep
>  sleep,
>  but not the deep sleep which we remember after waking.
>   >>>>>
>
>  Correct Sir, but this jnAnam take place in
>  antahkAraNam which can develop
>  again the
>  association with the body mind complex somehow, OR it can
>  not
>  this is the question to ponder upon.
>
>
>  >>>
>  H S Chandramouliji said
>  Even if it comes
>  back, the problem is only temporary. The problem pertains
>  only to the current body. It has been clearly
>  stated in the Shrutis that
>  once Jnana is
>  attained, there is no further transmigration for the Jiva
>  whatever happens in the intervening period till
>  the current body falls off.
>  >>>>
>
>  Sir, it means you accept that there is
>  possibility that a jnAni antahkaraNa
>  may
>  develop again thought "I am Body mind sense
>  complex." It looks like a
>  logical
>  possibility that after brain injury it can happen.
>
>  Now the question is,
>  promised vidheamukti should be there. But that is
>  because a jnAni does not claim  AgAmi karma
>  but if he develops again the
>   deha abhimAnam
>  then why will he not get the phalam of AgAmi karma?
>
>
>  >>>
>  Praveen R. Bhatji said
>  There is only
>  vikShepa, not AvaraNa. So the world is seen, but not as
>  different from brahman, since the true nature
>  has been revealed once and
>  for all.
>  >>>>
>
>  So there is a possibility of vikshepa without
>  avaraNa. Any pramanam,
>  dristAntam  for
>  that, I would like to know any reference, it would be
>  helpful.
>  Basically you are
>  saying if we know there is sand then even if we are
>  seeing water there then that is only vikshepam
>  and no avaraNa is there,
>  right? looks
>  perfect and it also leads to conclusion that for vikshepa
>  to
>  work avaraNa is not necessary.
>
>
>
>
>  Thanks
>
>
>  On Fri, Jan 15, 2016 at 9:21
>  PM, kuntimaddi sadananda <
>  kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com>
>  wrote:
>
>  > PraNAms
>  >
>  > Sri Vidyaranya
>  discusses this in the 7th Chapter of Pancadashi that we
>  are
>  > currently doing for Advaita
>  Academy. He discusses this using the example of
>  > the 10th man. The 10th man out of sorrow
>  that the 10th man is lost keeps
>  > hitting
>  his head and hurts himself - later he discovers that the he
>  is the
>  > missing 10th man when the
>  teacher says the tat tvam asi - you are what you
>  > are seeking all the time. Having
>  discovered that he is the tenth man does
>  > not remove his head injuries. Hence goes
>  through the medical treatment but
>  > that
>  does not destroy his knowledge that He is the one whom he
>  has been
>  > seeking all the time. This is
>  true for the head injuries any injuries
>  >
>  before after the jnaanam. Hence Krishnas statement -
>  duHkeshu anudvigna
>  > manaaH, sukheshu
>  vigata jwaraH...
>  >
>  >
>  Another aspect Vidyaranya discusses that even when one knows
>  that it is
>  > magic show and what is
>  happening on the stage is not really real, that
>  > knowledge does not obstruct one enjoying
>  the show. In fact one enjoys more
>  > since
>  it is not real and appears to be so real. The whole world
>  becomes a
>  > vibhuti for the self-realized
>  person. That of course includes not only the
>  > waking state, dream state and even the
>  deep - sleep state experiences.
>  >
>  > Hari Om!
>  > Sadananda
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  --------------------------------------------
>  > On Fri, 1/15/16, H S Chandramouli via
>  Advaita-l <
>  > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
>  wrote:
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >  Sri Rajesh Ji,
>  >
>  >  Reg your query
>  << If
>  >  it is same then is it
>  possible that after some
>  >  brain-injury
>  his wrong
>  >  conclusion, I am body,
>  based on avidhyA could
>  >  come
>  back.>>,
>  >
>  >
>  Even if
>  >  it comes back, the problem is
>  only temporary. The problem
>  >
>  pertains
>  >  only to the current body. It
>  has
>  >  been clearly stated in the
>  Shrutis that
>  >  once
>  >  Jnana is attained, there is no further
>  transmigration for
>  >  the Jiva
>  >  whatever happens in the intervening
>  >  period till the current body falls
>  off.
>  >
>  >  Regards
>  >
>  >
>
>
>  --
>
>
>  *Rajesh Benjwal*
>
>   e:rbenjwal at gmail.com
>  | w:ractors.com |
>  <http://facebook.com/rajesh.benjwal>
>
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-- 

Aurobind Padiyath
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