[Advaita-l] Shankara and DrishTi-SrishTi vAda - eka jeeva vaada

[Ryan Armstrong]

Namaste

Sri Subramanian has sent me an explanation of his statement as a sound file.
It has been uploaded to my Google Drive and is included  here for anyone
interested in listening to it:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BzTISeCyR5cCNFdSSk43OTVuOUU

Please accept appologies if I do not quite follow the conversations
accurately - the tradition has a vast scope, and I am still relatively new
to it.

Yours in Truth
Ryan

On 11 May 2016 at 15:56, Ryan Armstrong <ryanarm at gmail.com> wrote:

> Sri Subrahmanian
> namaste
>
> We recently had a week's satsanga reflecting on this very verse (Br. Up.
> 1.4.10), and the experience was different to your explanation.
> The verse begins:
> ब्रह्म वा इदमग्र आसीत्तदात्मानमेवावेदहं ब्रह्मास्मीति
> One thing which stood out is the word अग्रे which is translated as "in the
> beginning".  But it also means "at the tip".
> In the bhaashya, Shankara makes a simple statement about this - "before
> realisation".
> The point I am making is that I do not believe the shruti to be describing
> the process of world creation, but rather the process of
> "ignorance-shedding".
> The sense is that, even before realisation, while ignorance remains, even
> then we are already ब्रह्मन्.
> Everything is only ever the ब्रह्मन्.
>
> So if you mean that Shankara accepts avidya to this Brahman when in the
> form of an ignorant person (as is the current state of this being) then
> your statement seems correct.
> But if you mean that the Brahman Itself has avidya, I am not sure I can
> agree.
>
> One further sense was that we are stuck with this concept of काल and
> avidya only has existence within काल.
> So I believe that right now I am ignorant, and that at some time I shall
> become liberated.
> The Truth is that who "I am" is already liberated and that which desires
> the liberation is the very avidya itself.
> But the Brahman has no such limiting adjunct (as time) and cannot
> therefore have avidya.
>
> Yours in Truth
> Ryan
>
> On 11 May 2016 at 14:08, V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
>> On May 11, 2016 5:14 PM, "H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l" <
>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>> >
>> > Sri Praveen Ji,
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Namaste.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Three versions have been furnished for the Creator and Jiva in respect
>> > of ekajIvavAda.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > For the first one cited from sidhhAntaleshasaMgraha of appayya dIkshita
>> > author is not
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > given. Second one is by Sri MadhusUdana Sarasvati in siddhAnta bindu.
>> Third
>> > one is by
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >  Sri PrakAshAnanda in his vedAntasiddhAntamuktAvalI. In all three
>> Creator
>> > himself
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >  appears as the Jiva also and gets “liberated”. This particular concept
>> I
>> > have not been
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > able to identify in any of  the 10 upanishads we normally refer to.
>>
>> The Br. Up. 1.4.10 is about Brahman itself getting the realization 'aham
>> Brahma asmi' and attaining sarvatmabhava. Shankara accepts avidya to this
>> Brahman.
>>
>> VS
>>
>>
>> Since
>> > it is accepted
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > that “liberation” is possible ONLY through shravana of the Upanishads
>> and
>> > upadEsha of
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > mahAvAkya by the guru, can you please clarify which of the Upanishads
>> are
>> > takenup for
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > shravana in respect of each of these concepts and the corresponding
>> > mahAvAkya.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Also is DSV always identified with ekajIvavAda or is it also explained
>> as
>> > applicable to
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > nAnAjIva vAda?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I would be grateful for a clarification.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Pranams and Regards
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
> Regards
>
> Ryan Armstrong
> +27 82 852 7787
> ryanarm at gmail.com
>



-- 
Regards

Ryan Armstrong
+27 82 852 7787
ryanarm at gmail.com