[Advaita-l] Time not Death

[Sujal Upadhyay]

Pranams,

I agree :) positively. So instead of 'concept' it is better to use
'vyavahArika satya' to describe time and mAyA.

Hari OM
Sujal


On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 12:08 PM, H S Chandramouli <hschandramouli at gmail.com
> wrote:

> Pranams.
>
>
>
> Reg  << Am I getting it wrong? >>,
>
>
>
> Since you are asking, I am answering. I think so.
>
>
>
> When you ask  << Can it be considered as real or truth?>>,  the answer is Time
> is vyAvahArika satya. It is anirvachaniya, just as mAya is. I hope I have
> stated my understanding clearly.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 11:56 AM, Sujal Upadhyay <sujal.u at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> prANAms,
>>
>> There is no one 'else' to experience it separately. If you say, there is
>> absolutely no one who can experience, then we are negating Brahman. Is it
>> not SunyavAda? If we do not agree that such a state exists, which is beyond
>> mAyA, then is this the final position of advaita?
>>
>> If one has to explain this non-dual state, how can one explain this
>> inexplainable state?
>>
>> Secondly, 'concept' means 'it is construct of mind' because in nirvikalpa
>> samAdhi and in deep sleep, one is beyond time. 'Change' is the nature of
>> time' Anything that changes is not constant. Can it be considered as real
>> or truth? Am I getting it wrong? Does the state of nirvikalpa samAdhi
>> accept time as eternal truth? Does advaita accept time as eternal and hence
>> truth? Please clarify.
>>
>> OM
>>
>> Sujal
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 11:48 AM, H S Chandramouli <
>> hschandramouli at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Reg  << when mind is extremely purified, we will have to rise above
>>> mAyA. Hence for such a divine soul, time is a concept of mind as when one
>>> is in suShupti or in samAdhi, one does not experience any time i.e. one is
>>> not aware of how much time one has spent in deep sleep (suShupti) or how
>>> much time one was in nirvikalpa samAdhi.>>,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> When one has transcended mAya, or in Sushpti or samAdhi, one does not
>>> experience Time. So how can it be a “concept”. He just does not experience
>>> it at all. Period.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 11:34 AM, Sujal Upadhyay <sujal.u at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> praNAms,
>>>>
>>>> Without Space and time i.e. deSa and kAla, there can be no activity and
>>>> hence no creation, preservation and destruction. Hence when talking about
>>>> any activity, these two have to be taken into account, but from pArmArthika
>>>> satya, one is only aware of Self- Atman or Brahman and nothing else.
>>>> Brahman devoid of space and time is nirvikalpa, achala, etc It cannot do
>>>> any activity.
>>>>
>>>> In order to understand creation and for sake of explanation for various
>>>> doubts, mAyA and so space and time has to be taken into account. But if one
>>>> wishes to move ahead i.e. go further deep to finally cross the border of
>>>> mAyA, then mAyA, space, time and any such phenomenon has to be downgraded
>>>> i.e. it's importance has to be decreased, so that mind will stop getting
>>>> attached to them or getting attracted or immersed into them and finally
>>>> rise above them to enter into nirvikalpa samAdhi.
>>>>
>>>> From collective view point, we cannot ignore mAyA, space and time, but
>>>> from individual standpoint, one day, when mind is extremely purified, we
>>>> will have to rise above mAyA. Hence for such a divine soul, time is a
>>>> concept of mind as when one is in suShupti or in samAdhi, one does not
>>>> experience any time i.e. one is not aware of how much time one has spent in
>>>> deep sleep (suShupti) or how much time one was in nirvikalpa samAdhi.
>>>>
>>>> When there is no time, there cannot be any space or any distance that
>>>> can be traveled. If there is no distance or space between observer and
>>>> object (of / under observation), then there cannot be any object. Only pure
>>>> consciousness remains. There is in-explainable (deep) peace. eko Brahman -
>>>> SAntam Sivam advaitam.
>>>>
>>>> So, we will have to take both statements (and both arguments) in right
>>>> context.
>>>>
>>>> When bhagavAn says, he is both time and *beyond time*, what I
>>>> understand is, bhagavAn or KRShNa is both sAkAra and nirAkAra or saguNa and
>>>> nirguNa.
>>>>
>>>> OM
>>>>
>>>> Sujal
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 11:18 AM, H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l <
>>>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Maya is anirvachaniya. It is not correct to state that it does not
>>>>> exist
>>>>> nor is it correct to say that it is only a concept. It is vyAvahArika
>>>>> satya. Same applies to kAla or Time. Upanishads clearly mention
>>>>> "creation"
>>>>> of Time.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jun 19, 2017 at 7:49 PM, Vēdānta Study Group via Advaita-l <
>>>>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> > hariH Om.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > */// Time is just a concept. It is like Maya. There is nothing
>>>>> called Maya
>>>>> > ///*
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Is there any pramana to suggest the above? As far as I know,
>>>>> shankarAchArya
>>>>> > mentions avidyA (for the sake of our discussion let us akin it to the
>>>>> > samaSTi mAyA) as having bhAva. It is a vastu enjoying existence,
>>>>> albeit a
>>>>> > dependent one. Therefore I am not too sure how we're saying there is
>>>>> > nothing called mAyA. As far as 'time' being just a concept, even
>>>>> this I
>>>>> > would approach with some skepticism. Space is just as real (or
>>>>> unreal) as
>>>>> > time is, in that they're both mithyA, but have a dependent vyAvahAra
>>>>> > reality.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > If time were just a concept, it would not be influenced by anything,
>>>>> which
>>>>> > we know to be untrue. But that aside, I'm we have shAstra to
>>>>> indicate that
>>>>> > mAyA is an existing principle, as are dEsha-kAlA
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Namaste,
>>>>> > Prashant
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On 19 June 2017 at 02:20, Jaldhar H. Vyas via Advaita-l <
>>>>> > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > > On Sun, 18 Jun 2017, R Krishnamoorthy via Advaita-l wrote:
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Time is just a concept. It is like Maya. There is nothing called
>>>>> Maya. We
>>>>> > >> give the name Maya to things which we are not able to fully
>>>>> understand
>>>>> > or
>>>>> > >> is beyond our logic. Time also does not exist. It is the name
>>>>> given to
>>>>> > the
>>>>> > >> duration that elapses between any two events which is measurable
>>>>> and
>>>>> > fully
>>>>> > >> recognisable. In the the Lord says I am Time to indicate He is
>>>>> eternal
>>>>> > >> that
>>>>> > >> is the duration of His presence is lmmeasurable. And All beings
>>>>> or non
>>>>> > >> beings
>>>>> > >> have limited duration between their birth to their death or end.
>>>>> > >>
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > This is true.  But it isn't it strange that people are afraid of
>>>>> death
>>>>> > but
>>>>> > > not afraid of time?  Shankaracharya brings this out in the
>>>>> mohamudgara
>>>>> > > stotra in which he admonishes an old man who is studying to
>>>>> vyakarana to
>>>>> > > "bhaje govindam".
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > This is another example of bad interpretations and translations.
>>>>> Some
>>>>> > > make it out to be some sort of tirade against grammar which is
>>>>> ridiculous
>>>>> > > to anyone who knows the position vyakarana plays in Sanskrit
>>>>> scholarship.
>>>>> > > (In fact according to thinkers like Bhartrahari, it is itself a
>>>>> form of
>>>>> > > Vedantic sadhana.)  No; what the acharya is saying is that why
>>>>> would you
>>>>> > > wait until your time has almost run out to begin sadhana?  The
>>>>> right time
>>>>> > > is now.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > --
>>>>> > > Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>
>>>>> > > _______________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>