[Advaita-l] Vaadiraaja Teertha's Yuktimallika - Advaita Criticism - Slokas 1-10 to 1-13

[Sujal Upadhyay]

praNAms,

​Shri Subbu ji says:

**In Dvaita there is a svarupa sharira for the jiva which will never cease
to
be and will continue in moksha. With that sharira which has mind, sense
organs, etc which is all chinmātra, the jiva will enjoy all sense pleasures
and engage in devotional practices in moksha. And that svarupa of the jiva
is atomic in size as per their doctrine.

What I have heard is that the Jiva, which is aNu (of atomic size) and it's
svarUpa with mind is abheda and advitiya or non-dual.

In case of dvaita's concept of moksha, jIva will have personality of male
or female. secondly they are bound in vaikuNTha so that they can stay in
intimacy of bhagavAn viShNu, serve his lotus feet eternally and be in
constant divine company of beloved bhagavAn viShNu. There is no vaikuNtha
on earth, it is a different specific place and has specific location, so I
use the word 'bound'. If it is infinite, then vaikuNTha is everywhere and
so there cannot be any travel to that place, just realization of that place
and so there cannot be any fall from that place.

I have also heard that no one from vaikuNTha ever falls back i.e. there is
no return to earth or any other kingdom. The case of jaya and vijaya is an
exception and had divine purpose, though some new ISKONites claim that one
can indeed fall from vaikuNTha citing example of jaya and vijaya, though
Srila Prabhupada himself didnt acknowledge the same.

Refer:

https://www.vedabase.com/en/sb/7/1

7.1.34-38

also also

http://vaniquotes.org/wiki/It_is_a_fact_that_no_one_falls_from_Vaikuntha

"Otherwise it is a fact that no one falls from Vaikuṇṭha. "

Coming back to the point, one cannot be a jivanmukta as per dvaita, as one
cannot return back from vaikuNTha.

​Hari ​
OM

Sujal


On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 11:21 AM, V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 9:46 AM, Sriram Sankaranarayanan via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> > Some of my answers below in blue. Other knowledgable members please
> correct
> > me if my understanding is wrong.
> >
> > Hamsah Soham
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 1:08 PM, Kalyan via Advaita-l <
> > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >
> > > //By the way, the same upanishat passage also says, in the same
> context,
> > > atra
> > > pitA apitA. Kindly exert the might of your logic to show why pitA is
> > also a
> > > "verb."//
> > >
> > >
> > > Leaving aside the question of verbs, can't we interpret this passage in
> > > the following dvaita-friendly way -
> > >
> > > In the state of moksha -
> > >
> > > 1. Vedas do not give any new knowledge to the mukta because the mukta
> > > already got all the knowledge that he/she could absorb from the vedas.
> > Thus
> > > vedas have no further utility *as vedas* to the mukta.
> > >
> > ​
> > But then this clearly indicated that Gyana is indeed the means to Mukti.
> > Because it is at Mukti that you don't get any new gyana from veda. So
> till
> > you are at mukti, you get/need to get gyana from veda. So it is indeed
> the
> > complete achievement of Gyana that is mukti. This will then contradict
> the
> > dvaita/Visishtadvaita stand that one first gets gyana, and then from that
> > gyana they perform bhakti/karma etc and in turn only re-inforce Advaita.
> >
>
> Apart from this, the proposed position suggests two view points: a
> mukta-view point of the veda and the amukta view point of the same. This is
> only a rephrasing of the Advaita position.
>
> Also, if the vedas are no longer useful to the mukta 'as veda', then, in
> what way does the veda continue to exist for the mukta? If 'vedatva' is
> divested of the veda by the mukta, the veda ceases to exists; just as a pot
> if it does not have potness, ceases to be a pot.
>
>
>
> > >
> > > 2. A father is no longer a father, as the bonds with all his past
> > children
> > > have been dissolved due to moksha and only his bond with the dvaitic
> > > brahman remains.
> > >
> >
> > ​bond with the Brahman remains, what is the nature of that bond?
> > When everything else has gone away, what is there between Jeeva and
> Brahma?
> > Will Jeeva worship Brahma? In what way? Jeeva will bow? "bowing" is not
> > defined since there is no bond with the body! Jeeva will do kainkarya?
> no,
> > all bonds with any instrument of kainkarya are already lost. So naturally
> > shruti vakyas including aham brahmasmi, tattvamasi remains. As Jagadguru
> > said, "Atha parabrahmaatmanaa stheeyataam" happens.
> >
>
> ​​
> In Dvaita there is a svarupa sharira for the jiva which will never cease to
> be and will continue in moksha. With that sharira which has mind, sense
> organs, etc which is all chinmātra, the jiva will enjoy all sense pleasures
> and engage in devotional practices in moksha. And that svarupa of the jiva
> is atomic in size as per their doctrine.
>
> vs
>
> >
> > >
> > > Interpreted in this way, these statements do not imply a sublation of
> the
> > > world. However, what problems can come up with the above kind of
> > > interpretation of these statements?
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Kalyan
> > > _______________________________________________
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