[Advaita-l] Fwd: Rama and Krishna are Jiva-s - Mahabharata

[Vidyasankar Sundaresan]

Kalyan,

1. You are not the first nor the only "not a traditional advaitin" on this
list. That is not an excuse for your obnoxiousness here. In my experience,
unlike you, most "not traditional advaitins" are quite decent people and
pleasant to deal with.

2. You are the first "not traditional advaitin" here, who has been so
disruptive in every discussion thread where you have participated. The
manner and content of your responses to various members, including Anand
Hudli, YR Bhaskar, Praveen Bhat, S Venkataraghavan and V Subrahmanian among
others, has always been questionable at best, all through the last three
months. I watched and waited till this last week, before pulling moderator
rank on you, to tell you that your modus operandi is not appreciated by
anybody with whom you have chosen to engage during this time.

3. Your behavior on this list is completely contradictory to your stated
purposed of wanting "to understand how traditional advaitins are convinced
of the truth of the philosophy." The manner of your engagement with
"traditional advaitins" is guaranteed to generate nothing but
misunderstanding. In any case, your introductory note conveniently left out
that you saw "unresolvable (sic) questions and contradictions." If you had
stated that up front, we moderators would have asked you to clarify, prior
to subjecting 500+ members of this list to these unsavory exchanges in
public.

4. You are in no position to claim that you have not personally attacked
any member of this forum. I gave you a mild warning about modulating your
online behavior and you launched into an attack on the entire list in
response.

http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/2017-May/045201.html

Through that one post, you questioned the integrity of every single person
who is on this list. As a moderator, I'm merely doing my job. I have had to
drag it out of you, regarding your past history as a member of this list
from a different email ID. Hiding who you are is operating in bad faith.I
have asked you why you still want to associate yourself with us, no matter
which way you look at it. Your answer to that part is still pending.

5. Of course, you can only expect "similar behavior" from our side. And you
are getting back exactly that, although it is actually a lot milder than
what you otherwise deserve. Still, you reap as you sow.

Vidyasankar


On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Kalyan <kalyan_kg at yahoo.com> wrote:

> //
> You have not answered my straightforward question, "what is your purpose
> for being on this list?" //
>
> I will answer this question if only to reduce your anger. But before
> answering, let me make a small point. In my introductory message itself I
> made it very clear that I am not a traditional vedAntin. Refer below link -
>
> http://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/2017-
> February/044615.html
>
> So the moderators admitted me into the list, knowing fully well that I am
> not a traditional advaitin.
>
> Now to answer your question - I joined this list to understand how
> traditional advaitins are convinced of the truth of their philosophy, in
> the light of what I see as unresolvable questions and contradictions in
> advaita.
>
> Now I hope your question is answered. I have infact not written any post
> here where I personally attacked any member of this forum. I expect similar
> behavior from your side.
>
> --------------------------------------------
> On Wed, 5/24/17, Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>  Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Fwd: Rama and Krishna are Jiva-s - Mahabharata
>  To: "Kalyan" <kalyan_kg at yahoo.com>
>  Cc: "Venkata sriram P" <venkatasriramp at yahoo.in>, "A discussion group
> for Advaita Vedanta" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
>  Date: Wednesday, May 24, 2017, 2:22 PM
>
>  That's
>  rich, Kalyan. If you think you are provoking me by
>  repeatedly bringing up my being a moderator here, you're
>  not. You're merely proving that you're a
>  curmudgeon.
>  You have not
>  answered my straightforward question, "what is your
>  purpose for being on this list?" Others, who are not
>  moderators of this list, have asked you the same question
>  and you have yet to answer that. You had better find a way
>  to answer that and decide for yourself whether you want to
>  contribute productively or if you simply want to shoot and
>  scoot.
>  Vidyasankar
>
>  On Wed, May 24, 2017 at
>  9:39 AM, Kalyan <kalyan_kg at yahoo.com>
>  wrote:
>
>  Calm
>  down. Just because you are the moderator you cannot write
>  abusive messages. I have merely presented the facts from
>  Shankara bhAshyas. I have not invented anything on my own.
>  There is no need to get so angry. There is no need to
>  develop a visceral hatred for me.
>
>      On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 6:44 PM,
>  Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar at gmail.com>
>  wrote:
>
>
>   Oh,
>  come off it. You know, sometimes it's better to keep
>  quiet and be thought a fool than to say something and remove
>  all doubt. It's a pity that you've been repeatedly
>  choosing the latter option.
>  Once
>  again, what is your purpose in being on a list that is
>  dedicated to traditional advaita vedAnta if you have a poor
>  opinion of everyone from Adi Sankara down? Just to exhibit
>  some bravado daring the moderators to throw you
>  out?
>  Vidyasankar
>  On May 24, 2017 7:44 AM,
>  "Kalyan" <kalyan_kg at yahoo.com>
>  wrote:
>  //The
>  criticism of these other schools centers around the fact
>  that none of them are independent means to moksha. The same
>  Sankara also accepts whatever is right and good in these
>  other schools, subject to agreement with the aupanishada
>  teachings.//
>
>  Once
>  again, reality is different from the above. In BSB 2.2.32,
>  Shankara summarily dismisses the entire Bauddha school. He
>  further says that either the Buddha is a man who makes
>  incoherent assertions or has hatred for all beings.  This,
>  despite the fact that Shankara himself acknowledges the
>  closeness of his school with that of the Buddhists in his
>  Mandukya karika bhashya!
>
>      On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 4:13 PM,
>  Vidyasankar Sundaresan <svidyasankar at gmail.com>
>  wrote:
>
>
>   The
>  criticism of these other schools centers around the fact
>  that none of them are independent means to moksha. The same
>  Sankara also accepts whatever is right and good in these
>  other schools, subject to agreement with the aupanishada
>  teachings.
>  SrutyanusAra-ananusAra
>  vishaya-vivecanena sanmArge prajnA sangrahaNIyA, and
>  paramatam apratishiddham anumataM bhavati, he
>  says.
>  In contrast,
>  bhakti towards a particular form of ISvara is a key step in
>  the jnAnamArga of advaita vedAnta, provided people don't
>  get caught up in the ridiculous my God is better than your
>  God attitude. Unfortunately, this is a trap that many
>  vaishNavas and Saivas find very difficult to
>  avoid.
>  Once again, rather than get caught
>  up in superficialities, please pay attention to the details.
>  There is a huge amount of material in our own list archives
>  as a starting point. That is, if one can put resentment
>  aside and read with an open mind.
>  Vidyasankar
>  On
>  May 24, 2017 4:49 AM, "Kalyan via Advaita-l"
>  <advaita-l at lists.advaita-
>  vedanta.org> wrote:
>  //Here lies the greatness of we
>  advaitins that we never criticise any path and take
>  everyone in our own stride and move on....//
>
>
>
>  Sri Venkata Sriram, Shankara has criticized mimamsa, nyaya,
>  samkhya, yoga, vaiseshika, bauddha, jaina, pashupata,
>  pancaratra, carvaka philosophers in his commentaries. To say
>  that advaitins do not criticize anybody is far removed from
>  reality.
>
>  RegardsKalyan
>
>
>
>
>
>      On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 1:28 PM, Venkata sriram P
>  via Advaita-l <advaita-l at lists.advaita-
>  vedanta.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>   Namaste,
>
>
>
>  ////
>
>
>
>  Appayya Dikshitha probably has not studied the entire
>  Mahabharata.
>
>  In Shanti parvan, when Vishnu shows his Vishwaroopa to
>  Narada
>
>
>
>  ///
>
>
>
>  Those who are making furore over the मन्दत्व
>  of अप्पय दीक्षितः, why don't
>  they raise
>
>  objections to the remark of वेदान्त
>  देशिकः when he makes a remark against
>  दक्षिणामुर्तिः
>
>  vide shloka no. 7 of his हयग्रीव
>  स्तोत्रं :
>
>
>
>  दाक्षिण्यरम्या
>  गिरिशस्य मूर्तिः देवी
>  सरोजासन धर्मपत्नी ।
>
>  व्यासादयोऽपि
>  व्यपदेश्यवाचः
>  स्फुरन्ति सर्वे तव
>  शक्तिलेशैः ॥ ७॥
>
>
>
>  "the pretty south-faced Ishwara (dakshinamurti), Devi
>  Saraswati and Bhagavan Badarayana -
>
>  all three draw their power of Knowledge from Lord
>  Hayagriva"
>
>
>
>  Granted that these compositions show one's devotion to
>  personal deity but is it not blasphemous
>
>  to say that the Dakshinamurti who taught the essence of
>  vedanta to great brahmanishtaas thru
>
>  silence draws His knowledge thru Hayagriva.  The greatness
>  of dakshinamurti is stated in Bhagavata Purana
>
>  itself in 4th chapter.  Having seated in 'mahAyOga'
>  rUpa 'vaTavrikSa', demonstrates the
>  'chinmudra' and dispels
>
>  the doubts to sages.
>
>
>
>  Now, should we advaitins conclude that Vedanta Desika
>  didn't study any shastras and was
>
>  ignorant of the dakshinamurti-tattva?  Certainly not.
>  Here lies the greatness of we advaitins
>
>  that we never criticise any path and take everyone in our
>  own stride and move on....
>
>
>
>  Advaitins are broad-minded and that is why it has become
>  more popular and
>
>  more acceptable today by great logicians and
>  philanthropists.
>
>
>
>  regs,
>
>  sriram
>
>
>
>
>
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