[Advaita-l] Difference between AkAsha and AvakAsha

[V Subrahmanian]

Thanks Sudhanshu ji for this excerpt.  While I would not hazard a guess, I
think avakasha is aakaasha with avaccheda, limiting adjunct, like a pot, or
walls, etc. Between walls/enclosures we have empty space, avakasha, which
is aakasha only without the enclosures.

BSB 1.3.14    ; द्यावापृथिव्यादि च तस्मिन्नन्तःसमाहितम् ,
अवकाशात्मनाकाशस्यैकत्वात्
।

BSB 1.3.41  आकाशशब्दस्य तस्मिन् रूढत्वात् ; नामरूपनिर्वहणस्य चा
वकाशदानद्वारेण तस्मिन्योजयितुं शक्यत्वात् ; [This is said by the pp but the
siddhantin does not refute this., as far as I see.]

The other two quotes from Tai.bha. shown by you are also not unrelated to
the above.

regards
subbu

On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 8:33 PM Sudhanshu Shekhar <sudhanshu.iitk at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hari Om V Subramanian ji,
>
> //The answer is: There is no invariable rule that adhyasa can occur only
> on an object in front. Akasa (ether) is not perceptible by the sense
> organs. Still blueness is superimposed on it. The Tarkika says that akasa
> is the abode of sound and so it is known only by inference. It is therefore
> not perceptible as an object in front even according to the Tarkikas. In
> spite of this, it is a well known fact that blueness is superimposed on
> akasa. Similarly adhyasa is possible on the self though it cannot be
> perceived as an object in front. By the use of the word ‘api’ after
> ‘apratyaksha’ in the bhashya the Acharya indicates that the view that akasa
> is apratyaksha is not accepted by Advaita. According to Advaita akasa is
> known directly by the witness-consciousness itself.
> The Bhattas hold that akasa can be seen by the eye. This is rejected by
> Advaita on the ground that, if akasa which has no form or colour can be
> seen by the eye, it should also be possible to know it by the sense of
> touch even though it does not have the quality of touch.
> An objection is raised that, since one has to open the eyes to see akasa,
> it is perceivable by the eyes.
> The answer to this is that one has to open the eyes to see the blue colour
> and not to see akasa. We can see with the eyes only things which are
> limited in size and not what are unlimited, like akasa and the form of
> Isvara. What we see with the eyes is not akasa but ‘avakasa’ or empty
> space. If a thing can be seen by the eye, its absence should also be seen
> by the eye. The rule is that the absence of a thing is known by the same
> sense-organ by which its presence is known. So if we say that there is no
> avakasa or empty space, it means that its absence is seen by the eye. So a
> person has to open his eyes only to see that no object with form is there
> and not to see empty space. *Avakasa (empty space) is different from
> akasa (ether). An empty space disappears when an object is put there, but
> akasa remains unaffected.* To know that a quality is or is not there, we
> have to know its abode, for example to know smell we have to know its
> abode, such as a flower. So when we say that there is no sound in a
> particular place, we have to say that there is no sound in this particular
> part of akasa. It is not necessary that the abode should be known by the
> same organ by which its quality is known. Smell is known by the olfactory
> organ, but the flower is known by the eye. We know sound by the ear, but
> its abode, akasa, need not be known by the ear. It is known by the
> witness-consciousness.//
>
> This is from Mani Dravid Shastri Ji's lecture. Can we have some more
> difference on the nature of avakAsha and AkAsha.
>
> Praveen ji, pl note that avakAsha is treated as empty space. There appears
> to be some crucial difference between these two which needs to be discussed
> thoroughly.
>
> Sudhanshu.
>
> On Tue 18 Jun, 2019, 18:52 V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l, <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 3:57 PM Praveen R. Bhat via Advaita-l <
>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>
>> > Namaste Sudhanshuji,
>> >
>> > On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 2:23 PM Sudhanshu Shekhar via Advaita-l <
>> > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Kindly share your views on difference between AkAsha and AvakAsha.
>> > >
>> > > Taittiriya 2.1.1 लक्षणं तु सर्वत एव, यथा अवकाशप्रदात्राकाशमिति
>> > >
>> > > Taittiriya 2.1.1 आकाशो नाम शब्दगुणः अवकाशकरो मूर्तद्रव्याणाम्
>> > >
>> > > These verses show AkAsha as avakAsha-pradAtrA or avakAsha-kara.
>> > Certainly A
>> > > cannot be A-pradAtra. A has to be ~A-pradAtrA otherwise the usage
>> will be
>> > > meaningless as agni is vahni-pradAtrA.
>> > >
>> >
>> > I am not sure I understand your question/ objection as AkAsha and
>> avakAsha
>> > have different meanings as space and occasion/ opportunity,
>> respectively.
>> > avakAshapradAtA AkAshaH means that AkAsha is that which provides an
>> > occasion/ opportunity for everything else, meaning it becomes an
>> adhikaraNa
>> > (so to say) for everything else to manifest. That is why AkAsha is the
>> > first to manifest.
>> >
>>
>> Akasha is admitted to be avakaashapraadtru, accommodates everything in
>> creation.  Without aakaasha nothing can stay, remain, as objects. Shabda
>> is
>> the basic guNa of akasha.
>>
>> regards
>> subbu
>>
>>
>>
>> > Kind rgds,
>> > --Praveen R. Bhat
>> > /* येनेदं सर्वं विजानाति, तं केन विजानीयात्। Through what should one
>> know
>> > That owing to which all this is known! [Br.Up. 4.5.15] */
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