[Advaita-l] A replica of Adhyasa Bhashya in the Gita Bhashya13.26

[Raghav Kumar Dwivedula]

> Namaste ji
> I got your first email as well as the second resent email. So your email
> client worked but only pretended it did not !(sending you a bounced mail
> notification.)
>
>
> On Fri, 1 May, 2020, 10:46 AM Praveen R. Bhat, <bhatpraveen at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Namaste Raghavji,
>>
>>
>> Resending the mail as it bounced off the admin with an error that the
>> content wasn't explicitly allowed. I do not know what Windows email clients
>> added!!)(
>>
>>
>> A doubt here -
>>
>> 1. You wrote - I think the Panchami just means hetu here.
>>
>>
>>
>> >>> Yes, it doesn’t mean upAdane panchamI as Venkatji clarified.
>>
>>
>>
>> 2. I’d be a little careful using it as a causative for adhyAsa as it might
>>
>> accrue the same flaw ajnAna being abhAvarUpa! 😊
>>
>> (I am intrigued...!)
>>
>>
>>
>> >>> Again, as Venkatji clarified, you cannot have something arising out
>> of lack of something (nothing), in this case abhAva of viveka.
>>
>>
>>
>> 3. And then concluded with nibandhanam = Karanam
>>
>> >>> I was slightly correcting and elaborating your samAsa vigraha. Here
>> the nibandhana is not kAraNa in the sense of upAdAna but more of a reason/
>> hetu answering the question such as tatra kiM kAraNam? upAdAna is
>> yatkinchidbhAvarUpa avidyA.
>>
>>
>>
>> Are not the ideas of "hetu", "causative factor" and "kAraNam"
>>
>> interchangeable , or am I missing something here?
>>
>> >>>Contextually, they maybe, but we have to understand the kArakArtha to
>> differentiate between them.
>>
>>
>>
>> I think if you could elaborate point 2, it should clarify the entire
>>
>> matter.
>>
>> >>> I hope it is clear now. I had just pointed out a caution on your
>> initial usage of words, nothing else, though you may not have meant it any
>> other way.
>>
>>
>>
>> Also to check if the following ways of putting it are correct, please let
>>
>> me know.
>>
>> 1. adhyAsa is caused by avidyA
>>
>> 2. avidyA is the hetu for the occurrence of adhyAsa.
>>
>> 3. avidyA is the kAraNam for adhyAsa.
>>
>> >>> As long as avidyA is not abhAvarUpa, all are correct, Sir. You can
>> even say avidyA is the hetu, reason, kAraNa, cause for vivekAbhAva and that
>> itself is saMyoga/ adhyAsa. The justification for the last is that if I
>> can’t differentiate between the body and me, where is adhyAsa happening
>> additionally. They are already mixed up being superimposed on each other.
>> If you inquire as to why are they are still mixed up, that leads to the
>> conclusion “Oh, I didn’t do viveka”! In other words, vivekAbhAva is a
>> post-mortem justification for adhyAsa to still continue but is itself
>> neither the cause, nor the kAraNa the way we otherwise understand avidyA to
>> be! It answers the question as to **why** adhyAsa continues, than **how**
>> adhyAsa comes about. And that is what, IMVHO, Bhagavan Bhashyakara means
>> there.
>>
> Thank you for highlighting that and mentioning Venkat ji's post. I see the
> challenge. I also wrote a detailed mail to Venkat ji explaining why I was
> trying to view equate the इतरेतराविवेकेन phrase with
> क्षेत्रज्ञस्वरूपविवेकाभावनिबन्धनः to show the concordance between the two
> bhAShyas. That part looks fine.
>
> But what I also was trying to say was that the 'how did adhyAsa arise' is
> also being indicated by these two words and not just the 'why does adhyAsa
> continue' - in other words I was trying to see a reference to
> yatkincid-bhAvarUpA avidyA is present there in these two words. The simple
> solution is to not do so.
>
>  Then the replica idea presented by Subbu ji is still validated but
> without running foul of the abhAva idea inherent in the word
> क्षेत्रज्ञस्वरूपविवेकाभावनिबन्धनः - which we just take to mean that until
> discrimination dawn's, and shravaNam of shAstra produces vidyA (the right
> Viveka), the adhyAsa does not totally cease.
>
> Om
> Raghav
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>> PS: Sorry I have to use >>> for my responses as I am using this new mail
>> client, which itself is avidyAkRta! I’ll move out soon.
>>
>>
>>
>> gurupAdukAbhyAm
>>
>> --praveen
>> Kind rgds,
>> --Praveen R. Bhat
>> /* येनेदं सर्वं विजानाति, तं केन विजानीयात्। Through what should one
>> know That owing to which all this is known! [Br.Up. 4.5.15] */
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 30, 2020 at 10:41 PM Raghav Kumar Dwivedula via Advaita-l <
>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>
>>> A follow up sentence I missed - the word "causative" is better written as
>>> 'causal' indicating its latency and absence of direct observability.
>>>
>>> Again, any corrections are welcome.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, 30 Apr, 2020, 9:59 PM Raghav Kumar Dwivedula, <
>>> raghavkumar00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Namaste Praveen ji
>>> > A doubt here -
>>> > 1. You wrote - I think the Panchami just means hetu here.
>>> >
>>> > 2. I’d be a little careful using it as a causative for adhyAsa as it
>>> might
>>> > accrue the same flaw ajnAna being abhAvarUpa! 😊
>>> > (I am intrigued...!)
>>> > 3. And then concluded with nibandhanam = kAraNam
>>> >
>>> > Are not the ideas of "hetu", "causative factor" and "kAraNam"
>>> > interchangeable , or am I missing something here?
>>> >
>>> > I think if you could elaborate point 2, it should clarify the entire
>>> > matter.
>>> >
>>> > Also to check if the following ways of putting it are correct, please
>>> let
>>> > me know.
>>> > 1. adhyAsa is caused by avidyA
>>> > 2. avidyA is the hetu for the occurrence of adhyAsa.
>>> > 3. avidyA is the kAraNam for adhyAsa.
>>> >
>>> > Om
>>> >
>>> > Raghav
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, 30 Apr, 2020, 9:41 PM Praveen R. Bhat via Advaita-l, <
>>> > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Namaste Raghav ji,
>>> >> (Thanks Subbuji for the OP)
>>> >>
>>> >> From: Raghav Kumar Dwivedula via Advaita-l
>>> >>
>>> >> Can we counter the objection (by just looking at this reference) that
>>> >> aGYAna is GYAnAbhAva? Since the abhAva reference is there in this gItA
>>> >> passage -  "तद्विवेकज्ञानाभावात्
>>> >> अध्यारोपितसर्परजतादिसंयोग..." .
>>> >>
>>> >> Would it be logical to say that the Panchami prayoga in
>>> >> vivekaGYAna-abhAvAt
>>> >> itself implies a causative factor for adhyAsa?
>>> >>
>>> >> >>> I think the Panchami just means hetu here. I’d be a little careful
>>> >> using it as a causative for adhyAsa as it might accrue the same flaw
>>> ajnAna
>>> >> being abhAvarUpa! 😊
>>> >>
>>> >> Also in  विषयविषयिणोः भिन्नस्वभावयोः इतरेतरतद्धर्माध्यासलक्षणः संयोगः
>>> >> क्षेत्र
>>> >> क्षेत्रज्ञस्वरूपविवेकाभावनिबन्धनः, a point to consider is whether the
>>> word
>>> >> nibandhaH can be taken as the "seat" or "basis" or "origin" - again
>>> all
>>> >> these have the causative sense. (...the other meaning of nibandhanaH
>>> as
>>> >> "fastening" or "tying together" is also there of course). So we could
>>> say
>>> >> अध्यासलक्षणः संयोगः विवेकाभावनिबन्धनः  (विवेकाभावः यस्य निबन्धनः सः
>>> >> विवेकाभावनिबन्धनः).
>>> >>
>>> >> >>> क्षेत्रस्वरूप-क्षेत्रज्ञस्वरूपयोः विवेकस्य अभावः निबन्धनं = कारणं
>>> >> यस्य संयोगस्य सः संयोगः क्षेत्रक्षेत्रज्ञस्वरूपविवेकाभावनिबन्धनः। I
>>> urge
>>> >> those interested to read Bhagavan Anandagiri’s TIkA on it ending
>>> nicely
>>> >> with सम्यग्ज्ञानात् अज्ञानतत्कार्यनिवृत्त्या मुक्तिः, इति स्थिते,
>>> फलितमाह-
>>> >> य एवमिति
>>> >>
>>> >> Kind rgds,
>>> >> --Praveen R. Bhat
>>> >> /* येनेदं सर्वं विजानाति, तं केन विजानीयात्। Through what should one
>>> know
>>> >> That owing to which all this is known! [Br.Up. 4.5.15] */
>>> >>
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