[Advaita-l] Inward and outward contemplation

[H S Chandramouli]

Namaste.

Sri Jaldhar Ji wrote

Reg  <<  What I am trying to get at is that to do this one must rigourously
inquire "what is it that is out there".  As a question, this is on the
same level as "who am I" >>,

The two questions are not considered to be on par. Understanding “who am I”
is considered to be far  more difficult than understanding the answer to
the question “what is out there”.  For example it is not essential to
acquire sAdhana chatushtaya sampatti  to get at an answer for the latter
question while it is stipulated for the former.  Also the level of manana
and nididhyasana needed for the former is of a far higher level than what
is needed in respect of the latter question. I am not elaborating on this
topic further.

Reg  << if jnana is only jIvabrahmaikyam than how to get from there to
"becoming
everything"?  There must jagadbrahmaikyam too no? >>,

No no.  jagadbrahmaikyam is not correct. Jagat and Brahman enjoy different
levels of Reality. There is no question of their aikyam. Frankly I am
really not sure if I am understanding  this part of your response
correctly. However I do agree paroksha jnana of Brahman is needed to get at
aparoksha jnanam of jIvabrahmaikyam. In my earlier post I had  included
this  under the jaganmithyatva jnana and  paroksha jnana of Brahman.
Regards

On Thu, Aug 26, 2021 at 12:36 PM Jaldhar H. Vyas via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> On Wed, 25 Aug 2021, Ven Balakrishnan via Advaita-l wrote:
>
> > The thrust of Gaudapada and Sankara is to regard the world - and most
> > particularly the body-mind - as unreal, illlusory.
>
>
> Incidently I am uncomfortable with the use of words like illusion and
> unreal.  They suggest to the English speaker the idea of falsehood; that
> the world is some kind of mental construct.  As far as I know the only
> major Indian darshan that believed this was the Bauddhas and only the
> Vignanavadis amongst them.  Although it is a little unwieldy, I prefer to
> talk of lower-order reality.  After all, vyavaharika satya is still satya,
> just a lesser kind.  Atleast we should say it is delusion not illusion.
>
> Other than this quibble though, I agree with you.
>
> > Ramana’s ‘who am I’  is doing just this.
>
> Contemplating thus will lead one to the realization that what was
> conventionally thought of as "I" is also delusion just like the
> world-appearance. "who am I" is an upasana for coming to that conclusion.
>
> Shastras contain many other upasanas.  We can also (note also not instead)
> profitably ask "who is the Sun", "who are the five fires", "who is the
> Gayatri mantra" etc. etc.
>
>
> On Wed, 25 Aug 2021, H S Chandramouli wrote:
>
> > As per the Advaita Sidhanta advanced by Sri Bhagavatpada,  Realization is
> > possible ONLY through  जीवब्रह्मैक्यज्ञानम् (jIvabrahmaikya j~nAnam).
> > "inward" contemplation  is compulsory.
>
> Yes.
>
> > Reg  <<  It
> > should defintely include inward focus but sometimes I think it gets
> > forgotten that Brahman is "pervades all this and ten fingers beyond" as
> > the purushasukta puts it.  The root bR^inn from which brahman is derived
> > also means growth or increase.  Brahman is as much "out there" as "in
> > here." >>
> >
> > But for successful  "inward" contemplation leading to जीवब्रह्मैक्यज
> > (jIvabrahmaikya j~nAnam), Vairagya is an essential sAdhana. This is
> aided by
> > जगन्मिथ्यात्वज्ञानम् (jaganmithyAtvaj~nAnam). It is essential to
> understand
> > what is “out there” is mithyA.
> >
>
> Yes.  What I am trying to get at is that to do this one must rigourously
> inquire "what is it that is out there".  As a question, this is on the
> same level as "who am I"
>
>
> > Reg  << Some experience a massive collapse of sense of self
> > where one seems to be nothing at all >>,
> >
> > This does not represent Realization.
> >
>
> Shakyamuni described his experience as nirvana, "snuffing out" like as a
> flame that is extinguished.  No wonder Gaudapadacharya says that though he
> may have been dvipadAnAm varam ("The best of men".  Literally "of the
> two-footed.") he did not understand the truth.
>
>
> > Reg  << Others have an equally massive
> > expansion of consciousness where one becomes everything >>,
> >
> > This indeed is Realization.
> >
>
> if jnana is only jIvabrahmaikyam than how to get from there to "becoming
> everything"?  There must jagadbrahmaikyam too no?
>
> --
> Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar at braincells.com>
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