[Advaita-l] Fwd: [advaitin] Yet another Mahavakya in the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad

[Venkatraghavan S]

Namaste,
Actually that quote is not saying that. It is a reply to the pUrvapakshi
who is arguing that because the shruti prescribes manana and nididhyAsana
after shravaNam, it follows that further effort is needed after shravaNam.

To this, the answer given is no, manana and nididhyAsana is not "an effort"
whose outcome is something different from the outcome of shravaNa - it is
for the very same purpose as shravaNa, for avagati - ie aparoksha jnAna.

That being the case, it follows that aparoksha jnAna is possible during
manana and nididhyAsana also. If that occurs, then it is a result of the
recollection of mahAvAkya that happens during manana nididhyAsana.

Regards
Venkatraghavan


On Wed, 27 Oct 2021, 08:58 H S Chandramouli, <hschandramouli at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Namaste.
>
> Reg  <<  Nor can one say that such a recollection of the mahAvAkya during
> manana and nididhyAsana cannot give rise to jnAna either. It contradicts
> both experience and the bhAShya to BS1.1.4 which
> says श्रवणवदवगत्यर्थत्वान्मनननिदिध्यासनयोः >>,
>
> The citation from BSB 1-1-4 itself shows that manana and nididhyAsana are
> not prescribed independent of shravaNa. It says that just as shravaNa is
> prescribed for jnAna, manana and nididhyAsana are also prescribed in
> addition. Experience cannot be a determining factor in such matters. Only
> shruti as understood through Bhashya is the determining factor.
>
> Regards
>
> On Wed, Oct 27, 2021 at 12:49 PM Venkatraghavan S <agnimile at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Namaste,
>>
>> From a practical perspective too, in manana and nididhyAsana also, one
>> recalls the shruti vAkya heard in shravaNam. All recollection is due to
>> samskAra of prior experience. One cannot hold that no  such recollection of
>> the mahAvAkya takes place.
>>
>> Nor can one say that such a recollection of the mahAvAkya during manana
>> and nididhyAsana cannot give rise to jnAna either. It contradicts both
>> experience and the bhAShya to BS1.1.4 which
>> says श्रवणवदवगत्यर्थत्वान्मनननिदिध्यासनयोः.
>>
>> Even if that is somehow true and jnAna cannot occur during manana
>> nididhyAsana - Suppose a person has overcome all his jnAna pratibandhas
>> after manana nididhyAsana over a long time.
>> It is not appropriate to insist that one must again go back to their guru
>> for mahAvAkya shravaNam so that they can get jnAna. And if they don't, that
>> they cannot be liberated in that birth!
>>
>> Regards,
>> Venkatraghavan
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 26 Oct 2021, 17:30 V Subrahmanian, <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 26, 2021 at 9:25 PM Venkatraghavan S via Advaita-l <
>>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Namaste,
>>>> samskAra need not be mentioned - as long as the possibility is not
>>>> denied,
>>>> there is nothing to say it is impossible.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In the Brihadaranyaka mantra 4.4.2  तं विद्याकर्मणी समन्वारभेते
>>> पूर्वप्रज्ञा च ॥ २ ॥  Shankara says for vidya: विद्याकर्मणी — विद्या च
>>> कर्म च विद्याकर्मणी विद्या सर्वप्रकारा विहिता प्रतिषिद्धा च अविहिता
>>> अप्रतिषिद्धा च,  all these learnt, studied, are part of the jiva who
>>> transmigrates to another body. दृश्यते च केषाञ्चित् कासुचित्क्रियासु
>>> चित्रकर्मादिलक्षणासु विनैव इह अभ्यासेन जन्मत एव कौशलम् , कासुचित्
>>> अत्यन्तसौकर्ययुक्तास्वपि अकौशलं केषाञ्चित् ;  what has been
>>> learnt/practiced stays with the individual forever as vasana and manifests
>>> in another body without the need for its abhyasa afresh.  He gives the
>>> example of drawing, etc. And concludes: तस्मात् एतत् त्रयं
>>> शाकटिकसम्भारस्थानीयं परलोकपथ्यदनं विद्याकर्मपूर्वप्रज्ञाख्यम् । यस्मात्
>>> विद्याकर्मणी पूर्वप्रज्ञा च देहान्तरप्रतिपत्त्युपभोगसाधनम् , तस्मात्
>>> विद्याकर्मादि शुभमेव समाचरेत् , यथा इष्टदेहसंयोगोपभोगौ स्याताम् — इति
>>> प्रकरणार्थः ॥  Since what is acquired stays, one should endeavor to do the
>>> good alone so that one gets a good life in future.
>>>
>>> From this it is clear that vidya, whether it is laukika or adhyatma,
>>> acquired in one life manifests in another life when the necessary
>>> circumstances are in place. So, it remains as samskara and aids
>>> its perfection.
>>>
>>> There is a famous subhashita too:
>>>
>>> गतेऽपि वयसि ग्राह्या विद्या सर्वात्मना बुधैः |
>>> यद्द्यापि स्यान्न फलदा सुलभा सान्यSजन्मनि  |
>>>
>>> The  wise and learned persons have ordained that 'Vidyaa' should be
>>> learnt even if  a person  becomes aged.
>>> Although such learning may not  be fruitful to him during his lifetime,
>>> in his next birth it is easier for him to acquire knowledge because of his
>>> 'Samskaars' in his previous birth .
>>>
>>> regards
>>> subbu
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Venkatraghavan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>