[Advaita-l] ***UNCHECKED*** Re: [advaitin] rope has some problem in rope snake analogy :-)

[Raghav Kumar Dwivedula]

Namaste Venkataraghavan ji

Can there be example of jnAnAdhyAsa without arthAdhyAsa? Can we say a
visual or auditory hallucination (of the type that's unconstitutional as in
schizophrenia a la "The Beautiful Mind" for example)?

Om




>
> I had meant buddhau in the sense of the adhyAsa being exclusively located
> in the mind, ie jnAna adhyAsa, with no corresponding artha adhyAsa, which I
> took to be the meaning ascribed to the phrase buddhiparikalpita by Sri
> Bhaskar ji.
>
> If you recall, I had mentioned that in artha adhyAsa, the superimposition
> of the snake takes place at the location of the rope, rather than it purely
> located in the mind. To which, Sri Bhaskar had cited this bhAShya to say
> that the snake is only located in the mind. He had said and I quote:
>
> "The rajju-sarpa example has been given to drive home the point that there
> is no sarpa in rajju and sarpaavayava are mere imagination."
>
> I had offered an alternative explanation for the phrase - whether you agree
> with that explanation or not, the more important question is whether you
> agree with Bhaskar ji with respect to this bhAshya being evidence of the
> rope snake being purely located in the mind ie refuting anirvachanIya
> khyAti or, alternatively, whether you accept that an anirvachanIya snake is
> created in the location of the snake at the time of adhyAsa.
>
> In fact, deep rooted conviction *in* the mind, buddhau parikalpitena,
> >  would be more appropriate in the current context, it being svAbhAvika,
> > naisargika.
> >
> Maybe, but my point is that this bhAShya is not a proof of the untenability
> of anirvachanIya khyAti - ie the creation of an anirvachanIya snake at the
> location of the rope (arthAdhyAsa) and the creation of a corresponding
> cognition of the snake in the mind (jnAnAdhyAsa). There are several
> possible interpretations of the phrase buddhiparikalpita that are possible
> and to reduce it to merely one and use it as evidence against anirvachanIya
> khyAti is untenable in my opinion.
>
>
> Reg  // That is why Shankaracharya mentions the mRtghaTa and the rajjusarpa
> > examples in the same sentence (because there is something additional he
> > wishes to convey with the second example) //,
> >
> > Notice the use of the word आदि(Adi)(etcetera) in  रज्ज्वादि
> सर्पाद्याकारेण
> > in respect of vivarta vikAra as against मृद्घटाद्याकारेण in respect of
> > pariNAma vikAra. It is used in respect of both रज्जु (rajju) and
> सर्प(sarpa)
> > in one while it is used only in respect of घट(ghata) but not in respect
> > of मृत् (mRRit) in the other.  Multiplicity is seen simultaneously in the
> > case of  mRtghaTAdi (such as pot, lump etc), and hence difference between
> > them can be  perceived by the mind. But multiplicity is not seen
> > simulataneously if only the standard rajjusarpa illustration is
> considered
> > for vivarta vikAra even if आदि(Adi)(etcetera) word is used in respect of
> > sarpa. Rope is perceived either as snake or as garland or as stick or as
> > crack in the wall, only one at a time. Difference cannot be perceived.
> > Hence रज्ज्वादि  in रज्ज्वादि सर्पाद्याकारेण  is intended to be the
> > equivalent for घटादि of मृद्घटाद्याकारेण. रज्ज्वादि represents all
> > objects simultaneously perceived at any given time, all of which are
> > vivarta vikAra. सर्पाद्याकारेण is to convey vivarta vikAra. They are all
> > conceived as different from each other by the mind though in reality they
> > are all सत्(sat) only. That in my understanding is what Sri Bhagavatpada
> > intends to convey by mentioning  the mRtghaTa and the rajjusarpa examples
> > in the same sentence.
> >
>
> I have a different understanding to the above to what you have provided,
> but that is not relevant to the point under discussion, so will not go into
> the reasons for that now.
>
> Regards,
> Venkatraghavan
>
> >
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