[Advaita-l] [advaitin] Re: Vasanas

[Ganesh B]

Namaste Chandramouli Ji

The scope of this discussion is actually very wide. I would like to just
present my observations below.

The Sadhana Chatushtaya Sampatti lists the various qualities one has to
acquire in order that one becomes eligible for Mahavakya Vichara.

It does not really specify how one ought to cultivate. Rather SCS is not a
method at all. It merely states that a साधनाचतुष्टय सम्पन्नः प्रमाता - is
an Adhikari.

Whereas Atma Vichara Marga as revealed by Ramana Maharshi is a method.

*It is, no doubt, said in some books that one should cultivate one quality
after another and thus prepare for ultimate moksha, but for those who
follow the jnana or vichara marga [the path of self-enquiry], their sadhana
is itself quite enough for acquiring all daivic [divine] qualities; they
need not do anything else.*
*(Day by Day with Bhagavan, 18th July, 1946)*

Traditionally after the Guru deems that a disciple is fit, only then does
he even begin to teach the Upanishads Mahavakya Vichara.



*Remarking to the others [Ganapati] Muni said, ‘The path of Self-knowledge
which Bhagavan teaches is so difficult even for the learned, and Bhagavan
advocated it to the poor villagers. I doubt whether they understood it and
still less whether they can practise it. If Bhagavan had advised them to
practise some puja or japa, that would have been more practical.’When this
was conveyed to Bhagavan, he commented, ‘What to do? This is what I know.
If a teaching is to be imparted according to the traditional way, one must
first see whether the recipient is qualified or not. Then puja, japa or
dhyana are prescribed step by step. Later the Guru says that this is all
only preliminary and one has to transcend all this. Finally, the ultimate
truth that “Brahman alone is real” is revealed and to realise this, the
direct path of self-enquiry is to be taught. Why this roundabout process?
Should we not state the ultimate truth and direct path at the beginning
itself rather than advocating many methods and rejecting them at the end?’*

But in the Vichara Marga as Revealed by Ramana Maharshi is all encompassing
- it is both means and the end as well.

Infact, through Atma Vichara, one can see for oneself in the mirror of the
values listed in the SCS. So Atma Vichara (Self Enquiry) is one among other
methods that is both the means for acquiring SCS as well as the end -
Atma-Sakashatkaram.

I do not see any conflict in practicing One's Swadharma Anushthanams along
with Atma Vichara as revealed by Bhagavan and also pursuing Mahavakya
Vichara with guidance from a Guru - all together.

Ultimately, it is an added advantage, is what I feel.

So there is no conflict with both - in the sense that following any method
whatsoever, SCS is sine qua non!

Namaskarams

On Sun, Feb 5, 2023 at 11:09 AM H S Chandramouli <hschandramouli at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Namaste Ganesh Ji,
>
> You cited the following in one of your recent posts
>
> <<  It is important for one who is seriously striving to attain
> realization of Brahman to eliminate not only desire, anger and greed but
> also, three types of impure Vasanas or mental tendencies >>.
>
> You are now citing from Sri Ramana Maharshi
>
> <<  When other thoughts arise, one should not pursue them, but should
> inquire: ‘To whom do they arise?’ It does not matter how many thoughts
> arise >>,
>
> You had also mentioned sAdhana chatushtaya sampatti as an essential
> prerequisite for  pursuing Brahmavidya.
>
> Does Sri Ramana Maharshi insist on such prerequisites for one to undertake
> the inquiry into "who am I " as stated above ?  Apparently anyone  can
> undertake such an exercise without any prerequisites. Or are  the
> requirements  in the two methods conflicting ?
>
> Regards
>
> On Sun, Feb 5, 2023 at 4:45 AM Ganesh B <ganesh.bala82 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> When other thoughts arise, one should not pursue them, but should
>> inquire: ‘To whom do they arise?’ It does not matter how many thoughts
>> arise. As each thought arises, one should inquire with diligence, “To whom
>> has this thought arisen?”. The answer that would emerge would be “To me”.
>> Thereupon if one inquires “Who am I?”, the mind will go back to its source;
>> and the thought that arose will become quiescent. With repeated practice in
>> this manner, the mind will develop the skill to stay in its source. When
>> the mind that is subtle goes out through the brain and the senseorgans, the
>> gross names and forms appear; when it stays in the heart, the names and
>> forms disappear. Not letting the mind go out, but retaining it in the Heart
>> is what is called “inwardness” (antarmukha). Letting the mind go out of the
>> Heart is known as “externalisation” (bahir-mukha). Thus, when the mind
>> stays in the Heart, the ‘I’ which is the source of all thoughts will go,
>> and the Self which ever exists will shine. Whatever one does, one should do
>> without the egoity “I”. If one acts in that way, all will appear as of the
>> nature of Siva (God).
>>
>> *Who Am I*
>> Ramana Maharshi
>> On Friday, February 3, 2023 at 7:23:03 AM UTC+5:30 Ganesh B wrote:
>>
>>> *WHAT DOES BHAGAVAN LIKE MOST?*
>>>
>>> Several people that come to Bhagavan’s presence become interested in
>>> Self-enquiry and do sadhana. Other people are not satisfied with mere
>>> looking around. They begin to say, “We will repair this,” or “We will
>>> improve that.” If they asked Bhagavan, he would say, “Yes, yes. That is
>>> good no doubt, but discuss the matter with the Office.” If the office staff
>>> and those people agree and place the matter before Bhagavan, he would
>>> merely nod his head in approval, but if they did not agree and sought his
>>> opinion, he would say, “I do not know. Do as you think best.” And as soon
>>> as they left, he would tell devotees, “Look. Without minding the purpose
>>> for which they come to the Ashram, they begin thinking of reforming the
>>> Ashram. It is enough if they reform themselves. Instead of that, they say,
>>> ‘We will do this and we will do that.’ What then? If all of them agree,
>>> then there is no trouble. But if what they say, the office staff do not
>>> like and what the office say, they do not like, in between, what is it I
>>> can do? Added to that, they enquire what it is that Swami would like to be
>>> done. Do I want all these things?”
>>>
>>> As an instance, one interesting thing happened here recently. A devotee
>>> came here and offered to supply a Kavacham (outer cover) for the Meru
>>> Prasthara Sri Chakram* made of copper with a silver plating over it. The
>>> Ashram authorities, however, wanted the cover to be made of pure silver. As
>>> they could not agree on this issue, they decided to refer it to Bhagavan
>>> and so came to the Hall. On behalf of the Ashram authorities, one of them
>>> approached Bhagavan and asked him with great reverence, “They say that they
>>> will make the outer cover for the Sri Chakra of copper plated with silver
>>> while we all feel it would be better for it to be made of pure silver. What
>>> is Bhagavan’s advice in the matter?”
>>>
>>> *Bhagavan*: “What have I to do with it? It is all right in whatever way
>>> it is done. Both of you come to an unanimous decision and do that which you
>>> have decided to be the best.”
>>>
>>> *Enquirer*: “Swami, we wish to know what Bhagavan would like us to do.”
>>>
>>> *Bhagavan*: “That is exactly what I am saying. That which you all agree
>>> to do in mutual consultation will be to my liking. If both of you give
>>> different opinions, what can I do?”
>>>
>>> *Enquirer*: “As we hold two different opinions, we are enquiring in
>>> order to find out what Bhagavan would like best.”
>>>
>>> *Bhagavan*: “Oh, I see. You want to know what Bhagavan would like best!
>>> What Bhagavan likes best is to remain silent without doing anything. If
>>> people with different opinions give up their mouna (silence) which is the
>>> embodiment of love, and come to me and say, ‘We will do this,’ and ‘We will
>>> do that,’ and enquire of me what I like better of the two, what can I say?
>>> If you all agree upon a course of action and then ask me for my opinion, I
>>> would then say it is all right. But when you are of two opinions, why do
>>> you come to me and ask me which I like the better? *What I like is, to
>>> know who I am and to remain as I am* with the knowledge that what is to
>>> happen will happen and what is not to happen will not happen. Is that not
>>> right? Do you now understand what Bhagavan likes best?” So saying Bhagavan
>>> assumed silence.
>>>
>>> *Letters from Sri Ramanasramam *
>>>
>>> On Friday, February 3, 2023 at 6:36:32 AM UTC+5:30 Ganesh B wrote:
>>>
>>>> It is important for one who is seriously striving to attain realization
>>>> of Brahman to eliminate not only desire, anger and greed but also, three
>>>> types of impure Vasanas or mental tendencies. This triad of Vasanas
>>>> comprises *Loka Vasana* or mental impression relating to the world, *Sastra
>>>> Vasana* or mental tendency pertaining to the scripture and *Deha
>>>> Vasana* or latent mental imprint concerning the body. These Vasanas
>>>> prevent the dawn of direct experience of the Truth. Thus, it is declared in
>>>> the Muktika Upanisad, "True knowledge never dawns in a person with Loka
>>>> Vasana, Sastra Vasana and Deha Vasana"'.
>>>>
>>>> Vasanas are the mental seeds owing to which feelings, such as of
>>>> desire, crop up quickly without being preceded by any deliberation. A boy
>>>> who has had the misfortune of being chased by a bull abruptly feels fear on
>>>> encountering another bull at some other time. The Vasana engendered by the
>>>> initial experience is activated by the sight of the second bull and it
>>>> agitates the boy's mind with fright. Countless Vasanas abide in the mind,
>>>> implanted and nurtured by the thoughts and experiences of the present and
>>>> previous lives. Good Vasanas aid spiritual progress while the bad ones are
>>>> antichetical to it. A bad Vasana can be rendered impotent by assiduously
>>>> cultivating a Vasana of the opposite kind. So, a spiritual aspirant should
>>>> neutralize the impure Vasanas that plague him by developing appropriate
>>>> pure Vasanas.
>>>>
>>>> *Loka Vasana* pertains to a fixation of the form, "I shall always
>>>> conduct myself in such a way that people do not censure me and, instead,
>>>> they praise me". This Vasana is an abstruction to a spiritual aspirant
>>>> because it demands what cannot be achieved. There will always be at least
>>>> some persons who disapprove of us or of what we have done.
>>>>
>>>> Sita was the exemplar of chastity. She even underwent an ordeal by fire
>>>> to confirm Her purity. Yet, the people of Ayodhya cast aspersions on Her
>>>> and censured Lord Rama Himself as being swayed by desire in accepting Her
>>>> at Lanka. If such be the fate of spotless Divinities like Rama and Sita,
>>>> what need be said about the fate of others? Hence, it has been stated,
>>>> "There is no available means by which one can satisfy all people. So, a man
>>>> should ever do what is right for him". The texts on iberation advise the
>>>> spiritual aspirant to treat praise and censure alike; he should rid himself
>>>> of Loka Vasana by realizing the futility of attempting what it entails.
>>>>
>>>> Some points need to be noted with reference to the eradication of Loka
>>>> Vasana. It does not imply that the aspirant nonchalantly dismisses the
>>>> views of others. He may certainly utilize the observations of others for
>>>> self-improvement; what he gives up is elation and displeasure when
>>>> appreciated and depreciated respectively. Conquest of Loka Vasana should be
>>>> attempted in the context of other spiritual disciplines For instance, it
>>>> would not be beneficial for a boy who avoids bad company primarily because
>>>> he wants to earn a good name at home to blindly check this aspect of Loka
>>>> Vasana without taking other steps. Further, one who tries to maintain an
>>>> image of being a rebel, who does not care about what others say, is also
>>>> under the grip of Loka Vasana; Onservation of that image is essential to
>>>> him.
>>>>
>>>> *Sastra Vasana* is of three types; *obsession with study*, *Preoccupation
>>>> with many subjects and marked squeamishness regard to observances specified
>>>> in the scripture*. The Tattiriya Brahmana contains a narrative that
>>>> can serve to illustrate the first kind of Sastra Vasana. Bharadvaja, the
>>>> Vedas says, seriously applied himself to the study of the Vedas for three
>>>> successive births. In his fourth life too, he wished to strive
>>>> unremittingly. Taking pity on him, Indra explained the impossibility of
>>>> learning all the Vedas then taught Bharadvaja about Brahman with
>>>> attributes. While Bharadvaja's study of the Vedas was not wrong, it was his
>>>> obsession with mastering all the Vedas that was the problem To get rid of
>>>> this type of Sastra Vasana, the aspirant should impress upon himself that
>>>> it is impossible to know a subiect in its totality.
>>>>
>>>> Addiction to the study of many subjects is also bad. The story of
>>>> Durvasa encountered in the Kavaseya Gita is pertinent. Durvasa, it is said,
>>>> once came to the assembly of Lord Mahadeva to pay his respects. He arrived
>>>> with a cart-load of books. Narada made fun of him by comparing him to an
>>>> ass burdened with a great load on its back. Irritated and cured of his
>>>> obsession, Durvasa dumped his books into the sea. Thereafter, Mahadeva
>>>> initiated him into the knowledge of the Atma.
>>>>
>>>> One should realize that the Supreme cannot be known by being
>>>> preoccupied with books on a variety of topics. Thus, the Katha Upanisad
>>>> declares, "This Atma is not attained through much study, through the power
>>>> of grasping the meaning of the texts or through much mere hearing".
>>>> Likewise, in the Chandogya Upanisad, we read that in spite of mastering a
>>>> wide variety of subjects, Narada was not free from grief as he had not
>>>> realized the Atma. To attain that sorrow-eradicating knowledge, he
>>>> approached Sanatkumara as a disciple. It has been said, "What is the point
>>>> in vainly chewing the filthy rag of talk about sacred treatises? Wise men
>>>> should, by all means, seek the light of consciousness within".
>>>>
>>>> Sincere practice of scripturally ordained rituals is essential for a
>>>> person who has not progressed to the stage when he can dispense with
>>>> rituals. However, undue fastidiousness with respect to religious
>>>> observances, which characterizes the third type of Sastra Vasana, is an
>>>> impediment. In the Yoga Vasishta, we encounter the story of Dasura which is
>>>> relevant here. Dasura, on account the of his intense fastidiousness was
>>>> unable to locate a single spot in the whole world adequately pure for him
>>>> to perform his religious rites.
>>>>
>>>> Sri Vidyaranya who has elaborately dealt with the destruction of
>>>> Vasanas in his Jeevanmukti Viveka, points out that Sastra Vasana leads to
>>>> pride of learning. This is a reason, in addition to the impossibility of
>>>> consummating the needs of Sastra Vasana, for the Sastra Vasana being
>>>> labelled as impure.
>>>>
>>>> Finally, we come to *Deha Vasana*. This is of three kinds the worst
>>>> being marked by the identification of the Atma With the body. Such
>>>> identification is wrong because this view is opposed by the scripture and
>>>> because it is the cause of misery. Unfortunately, it is almost universally
>>>> prevalent. Being difficult to uproot, it must be assiduously tackled by
>>>> cultivating the right notion that the Atma is distinct trom the body.
>>>>
>>>> The second type of Deha Vasana, is characterized by concern with the
>>>> acquisition of bodily grace. Motivated by the Vasana of this kind, people
>>>> strive, for example, to beautity themselves by the use of cosmetics and to
>>>> purity themselves by bathing in rivers like the Ganga. Cleanliness, per se,
>>>> is laudable and is listed among the eight noble qualities that all should
>>>> acquire. In the Yoga Sastra, it is described an important prelude to the
>>>> practice of meditation. What is Problematic is the false belief that the
>>>> body can really and consistently be made gracious or pure; this leads to
>>>> effort to accomplish what is impossible.
>>>>
>>>> Charm and sweet smell, for example, belong to the cosmetic and not to
>>>> the body, which is an assemblage of fat, flesh, bones, etc. A pretty attire
>>>> does not make the body different. Consumption of pepper to make the voice
>>>> is not necessarily eftective nor is the etfect undecaying. A bath makes the
>>>> body externally clean but only for a short while. As for scriptural means,
>>>> such as a bath in the Ganga, to attain purity, it must be noted that there
>>>> are powerful scriptural passages to the effect that the body is ever impure.
>>>>
>>>> The third form of Deha Vasana is related to the second kind; it is
>>>> characterized by the persistent effort to rid the body of flaws. Striving
>>>> to eradicate disease comes under this head. The problem is that diseases
>>>> cannot be always kept at bay nor can all ailments be cured. As for the
>>>> body, the scripture is emphatic that it is, by its very nature, the
>>>> repository of what is unclean. Thus, in the Maitri Upanisad, we have, "O
>>>> Lord, this body is malodorous, insubstantial and a compact mass of skin,
>>>> bones, sinews, marrow, flesh, blood, semen, mucus, tears, rheum, urine,
>>>> excreta, bile and phlegm. What sense is there in gratifying one's desires
>>>> in that.
>>>>
>>>> At this juncture, it is necessary to emphasize that the spiritual
>>>> aspirant should be clean and ought not to be negligent of health. A sick,
>>>> dirty body does not favour the practice ot spiritual discipline. The
>>>> aspirant should, however, get rid of his longing to appear attractive and
>>>> give up preoccupation with health and freedom from bodily defects. It is
>>>> noteworthy that in the Yoga Sutras it is specified that one who is
>>>> established in purity develops dispassion towards the body. Even normally
>>>> the body, it is one who bathes regularly who notices the foul oder of dry
>>>> sweat and the like, while a person who is habitually filthy is unlikely to
>>>> do so. Thus, it is the clean person who is better equipped to recognize the
>>>> innate impurity of the body.
>>>>
>>>> *Abhinava Vidyathirtha Swamigal *
>>>> *(*Enlightning Expositions)
>>>>
>>>> On Monday, January 30, 2023 at 5:32:57 PM UTC+5:30 Ganesh B wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Following is an interesting dialogue with HH Chandrashekhara Bharati
>>>>> Swamigal.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Devotee*: The number of vasanas or tendencies that rule our hearts
>>>>> are endless. How can we possibly control them ?
>>>>>
>>>>> *HH Sri Chandrashekhara Bharati*: The essential nature of a vasana is
>>>>> to seek expression in outward acts. This characteristic is common to all
>>>>> vasanas, good and bad. The stream of vasana, the vasand-sarit, as it is
>>>>> called, has two currents, the good and the bad. If you try to dam up the
>>>>> entire stream, there may be danger. The Sastras, therefore, do not ask you
>>>>> to attempt that. On the other hand, they ask you to submit yourself to be
>>>>> led by the good vasana current and to resist being led away by the bad
>>>>> vasana current. When you know that a particular vasana is rising up in your
>>>>> mind, you cannot possibly say that you are at its mercy. You have your wits
>>>>> about you and the responsibility of deciding whether you will encourage it
>>>>> or not is entirely yours. The Sastras enunciate in detail what vasanas are
>>>>> good and have to be encouraged and what vasanas are bad and have to be
>>>>> overcome. When, by dint of practice, you have made all your vasanas good
>>>>> and practically eli¬ minated the chance of any bad vasanas leading you
>>>>> astray, the Sastras take upon themselves the function of teaching you how
>>>>> to free your free-will even from the need of being led by good vasanas. You
>>>>> will gra¬ dually be led on to a stage when your free-will will be entirely
>>>>> free from any sort of colouring due to any vasanas. At that stage, your
>>>>> mind will be pure as crystal and all motive for particular action will
>>>>> cease to be. Freedom from the results of particular actions is an
>>>>> inevitable consequence. Both fate and vasand disappear. There is freedom
>>>>> for ever more and that freedom is called Moksha.
>>>>>
>>>>> ~ Dialogues with the Guru
>>>>>
>>>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "advaitin" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to advaitin+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/4b6884fe-38f6-4e0e-bcc6-cc0e48f70bd5n%40googlegroups.com
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/4b6884fe-38f6-4e0e-bcc6-cc0e48f70bd5n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>> .
>>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "advaitin" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to advaitin+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/CAEs%2B%2BdN7s2rqWkaQnf%2Bk3xp%3DrCmQmtyUJACG9ZyLbuK%2BKThJxA%40mail.gmail.com
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/CAEs%2B%2BdN7s2rqWkaQnf%2Bk3xp%3DrCmQmtyUJACG9ZyLbuK%2BKThJxA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> .
>