[Chaturamnaya] [Advaita-l] The Foundations of Adhyāsa - 8 (The Three States)

[Ravi Kiran]

Namaste,

A small clarification:

On Sun, Nov 18, 2018 at 9:42 AM H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Namaste Kartik Ji,
>
> Reg  << So it appears that although a Jnani may have so-called "waking" or
> "dream" states, there is a
> big difference in his case that the UNDERLYING Turiya state is never
> "forgotten". In other
> words, the Jnani does not have the *Adhyasa* of confusing the "waking" or
> "dream" to be real! >>,
>

does a Jnani know the dream to be unreal while in dream ? ( in other words,
the Turiya Jnana
attained in waking continues to be available during dream state also ? )

or it is to be understood that..

Jnani knows that dream is unreal and waking is unreal too (as all avasthas
are due to adhyaasa), during waking only?

Thanks

>
> Thanks for the clarification. In my understanding this sums up your
> response. I also think it is different from the assertive statements made
> in your earlier posts which led me to seek clarification. Also this  more
> or less tallies with my understanding as well.
>
> Regards
>
> On Sun, Nov 18, 2018 at 8:13 AM S Jayanarayanan via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> > H S Chandramouli hschandramouli at gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > > I hope I have understood you correctly. My query was whether the
> > Realized person ever experiences any of the
> > > three states, waking/dream/deep sleep, subsequent to Realization. And
> > your response is that he never again does so.
> > > Assuming that my understanding is correct, how to reconcile it with the
> > following observation made by you.
> > >
> > > << Ramana Bhagavan has talked about this in "Day by Day with Bhagavan"
> > (5-1-46):
> > >
> > >   "...as a matter of fact, our real state is what is sometimes called
> > >   turiya or the fourth state which is always as it is and knows nothing
> > >   of the three avasthas, viz., waking, dream or sleep. Because we call
> > >   these three avasthas we call the fourth state also turiya avastha.
> > >   BUT IT IS NOT AN AVASTHA, BUT THE REAL AND NATURAL STATE OF THE SELF.
> > >   When this is realised, we know it is not a turiya or fourth state,
> > >   for a fourth state is only relative, but turiyatita, the transcendent
> > >   state called the fourth state." >>.
> > >
> > > Sri Ramana Maharshi is considered to be a Realized person. From your
> > above observation, is it not clear that
> > > he was back to the waking state after Realization ?
> > >
> >
> > These are subtle questions that can be answered only after attaining true
> > Jnana!
> >
> > But here is a rough explanation from Ramana Maharshi Himself:
> >
> > Day by Day with Bhagavan, 19-3-45:
> >
> > "I remembered that some people once wanted to know if a
> > jivanmukta can have dreams. The doubt is natural, because we
> > believe jnanis have no sleep like ordinary men. So they may not
> > have dreams. I therefore asked Bhagavan about this matter, and
> > he said, “If the jnani can have a waking state, what is the difficulty
> > about his having a dream state? But of course as his waking state
> > is different from the ordinary man’s waking state, so his dream
> > state also will be different from the ordinary man’s dream state.
> > Whether in waking or in dream he will not slip from his real
> > state which is sometimes called the fourth or turiya state.”"
> >
> > So it appears that although a Jnani may have so-called "waking" or
> "dream"
> > states, there is a
> > big difference in his case that the UNDERLYING Turiya state is never
> > "forgotten". In other
> > words, the Jnani does not have the *Adhyasa* of confusing the "waking" or
> > "dream" to be real!
> >
> > Ibid., 19-11-46:
> >
> > “You are under the impression you are the body. So you think the
> > jnani also has a body. Does the jnani say he has a body? He
> > may look to you as having a body and doing things with the
> > body, as others do. The burnt rope still looks like a rope, but it
> > can’t serve as a rope if you try to bind anything with it. So long
> > as one identifies oneself with the body, all this is difficult to
> > understand. That is why it is sometimes said in reply to such
> > questions, ‘The body of the jnani will continue till the force of
> > prarabdha works itself out, and after the prarabdha is exhausted
> > it will drop off. An illustration made use of in this connection is
> > that of an arrow already discharged which will continue to
> > advance and strike its target. But the truth is the jnani has
> > transcended all karmas, including the prarabdha karma, and
> > he is not bound by the body or its karmas.”
> >
> > This is from "Be as you are" by David Godman:
> >
> > "The radio sings and speaks, but if you open it you will find no one
> > inside.
> > Similarly my existence is like the space; though this body speaks like
> the
> > radio,
> > there is no one inside as the doer."
> >  Regards,Kartik
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