Scale of Jnani's

swamy swarna swamyswarna at YAHOO.COM
Thu Mar 14 08:46:06 CST 2002

Om Namh Sivaya. Thanks for the slokas. This is the
benefit of Satsang, since knowledgeable readers will
correct us. However, I still have a doubt. Kindly

I present you an analogy. Light represents knowledge,
so let us say Sun is Jnani. A planet is a non-luminous
body, so we call it Ajnani. Now let us assume that the
planet is moving closer and closer to the sun. To a
distant observer, the planet now appears brighter and
brighter(by the reflected light) and may look like a
luminous body. However, till it actually falls into
the sun and loses its identity, a careful observer
will be able to differentiate the two objects.
Similarly a highly intelligent Sadhaka may appear to
be a Jnani but without the destruction of the ego he
doesn't become a luminary.

Another analogy. Let us think of a man bound by a
number of ropes. Slowly a rat (Sri Ganesha's vahanam,
can certainly help the Sadhaka's struggle for freedom
if He is pleased), starts nibbling at the ropes. As
the different ropes are cut away, the freedom of the
person to move his different limbs increases until he
is almost free, but till the last rope is severed, he
is still bound.

If we equate a Jnani with a Jeevanmukta, then to my
uninitiated intellectual mind, it still represents a
binary situation. Almost bright, almost free is not
the same as luminous, and free. From black to white,
we are moving. A faint grey is still white tinged with
a slight blackness. I would call such a person an
adept, a great Sadhaka.

Sorry if I have erred in logic. I would like to be
corrected. And it is a sign of my ego which likes to
intellectualise without experiencing the union,the

Thanks again.

Venkateswara Swamy Swarna

--- hbdave <hbd at DDIT.ERNET.IN> wrote:
> swamy swarna wrote:
> > Om Namah Sivaya. I joined the group recently, so i
> > don't have full info about the discussion, but the
> > grades or scales of Jnanis attracted my attention
> and
> > triggered theis response.
> >
> > Sri Dakshina Murthy is the Deity who chooses the
> > 'silence' as a method of imparting jnana to His
> > disciples. All other forms of Deities and
> Sadgurus,
> > meditate so that they may establish contact with
> the
> > infinite. When they need to impart this experience
> to
> > their Sishyas, they choose different methods,
> > depending upon the level of the sishya.
> >
> > Thus Sri Sankara came with a specific purpose of
> > teaching ordinary people like us and so had to
> speak
> > verbally and or dictate to his disciples so that
> the
> > message is preserved for posterity.
> >
> > Real Jnana has to be experienced and experience
> has no
> > words. However, to encourage Sadhakas on the path
> and
> > to help them to choose the path suited to them,
> the
> > Guru explains verbally His experiences. His Jnana
> is
> > certainly not reduced by that.
> >
> > And for those of you who are familiar to binary
> > system, Ajnana and Jnana are like those two
> states,
> > either I am a Jnanai or I am not.
> > Venkateswara Swamy Swarna
> > (Spiritual Sadhaka)
> I think it is very difficult to say that
> Jnani/Ajnani forms
> a binary system.
> What would be exact definition of a Jnani?
> Please consider this :
> In Bliss of Non-Duality (Brahmanande advaitananda),
> Swami
> Vidyara.nya says : (Translation by Swami Swahananda)
> :
> saccidaanandaruupe .a
> |
> svayamevaavajaanaati naamaruupe "sanai.h "sanai.h
>   ||   [80]
> With direct knowledge of Brahman - the Eternal
> Existence, Consciousness
> and Bliss, names and forms slowly  come to be
> disregarded.
> yaavadyaavadavaj~naa |
> yaavadyaavadviik.sate tattaavattaadubhe tyajet
>    ||  [81]
> The more duality is negated, the clearer the
> Realization of Brahman
> becomes,
> and as realization becomes perfected names and forms
> come to be
> disregarded of themselves.
> tadabhyaasena vidyaayaa.m susvitaayaa.m pumaan |
> jiivanneva bhavenmukto vapurastu yathaa tathaa   ||
> [82]
> When through the continuous practice of meditation,
> a man is established
> in the knowledge of Brahman, he becomes liberated
> even while living.
> Then
> the fate of his body does not matter.
> NOw, consider a person described by  [80] or [81]
> above, while he has
> not yet
> reached "perfection" (whatever it may be). Is he a
> Jnani or not?
> -- Himanshu

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>From  Thu Mar 14 11:06:38 2002
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March 12, 2002.

Sri Gurubhyo Namaha


      Please see attached from Sri Yegnasubramanian regarding the MahArudram
event scheduled for the upcoming Memorial Day weekend. The planning for this
event requires the participants' headcount as soon as possible. So, please send
your response to Sri. Vishwanathan Iyer at gv_iyer at or to Sri Venkat
Iyer immediately. If you have already responded to Sri Venkat Iyer's e-mail, you
could keep this as reference.


Ram Ramachandran

Ram, Banu & Jyotsna
rambanu at
>From: Srinivasa Yegnasubramanian
>To: yegnam at
>Subject: Maharudram
>Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 18:50:29 -0800 (PST)
>Hello all:
>As was announced during last year's Maharudram, we plan to have this year's
Maharudram on Sunday, the 26th May.
>(Memorial day weekend). As I have been mentioning all along, I try to arrange
these functions for the benefit of the class
>participants. Please respond by 3/17 (Friday) whether or not you will
participate. I have the following options:
>a) If we get enough number of participants to do it in one day, we will do it
on 5/26 (most desirable)
>b) If the number of participants are less than (a), and if people don't mind
coming to Stroudsburg for two consecutive days, we will do it on 5/25 and 5/26
(Saturday and Sunday); arrangements for accommodation have to be made by
participants; (some accommodation will be available for volunteers and some
out-station participants); involves lot of planning and preparation (less
desirable option)
>c) If the response is poor, in place of Maharudram, only laghururdam will be
conducted on any convenenint weekend, or along with the week end functions of
Sankara Jayanti or Vardhanti. (Personally, I will be very disappointed if the
Maharudram has to be replaced in this manner due to lack of participation by the
beneficieries of all my veda classes, past and present; I can always understand
personal, professional commitments or health related reasons)
>Having been confronted by a dilemma like this, I may totally withdraw the idea
of performing Maharudram every year; I cannot make a samklapam and go through
the preasure of fullfilling it everytime in a painful manner.
>Note: Class coordinators: Pl. forward to members in your list
>Venkat/Viswanathan: Follow-up with non-class participants (in and out of town)
and get their commitment.
>We need to make a decision by this weekend to print fliers etc. Pl. respond
>nArAyaNa smaraNam,


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