[Advaita-l] The jeeva can reach a state of no hope

[V Subrahmanian]

In the Chandogya Upanishad 5.10.8 reads thus:

8. "Those who neither practise meditation nor perform rituals do not follow
neither of these ways. They become those insignificant creatures which are
continually revolving and about which it may be said: `Live and die.' This
is the third place.''

The words for 'live and die' in the original are: jAyasva mriyasva.
Shankaracharya comments:

// They (these jivas who have not practiced upasana or who have not engaged
in scripture-based rituals) are born as these small creatures - gadflies,
mosquitoes, insects,etc., which transmigrate again and again. The meaning is
that: those who have fallen from both the paths (shukla and dhUma margas)
surely are born and die, again and again. Their continuity in a succession
of birth
and death is being stated thus: jAyasva mriyasva - 'Be born and die', is
being stated the action directed by God. Their time is spent in mere birth
and death. But they have no time either for work or for worthy enjoyment. As
compared with the two paths stated earlier, this is the third state of
transmigration as exemplified by these small creatures. //

  Apart from the authorities I had quoted from in my first post, here is one
more:
Sri Shankarananda (Guru of Sri Vidyaranya) in his independent commentary on
the Bhagavadgita too says on the verse 16.20 that // as per the Chandogya
mantra cited above, these lowly creatures will never at all attain the
liberated state. They will be for ever be born and dying. *They will never
get the human body that is suited to practice the disciplines required for
liberation. *They will
be taking birth in even lower forms like trees, stones etc or ghosts but
never those forms of animals like dog. //

While commenting on these verses of the Gita, neither Shankaracharya nor the
other Advaita Acharyas are unaware of the fact that every jiva is in truth
sat chit ananda alone. For a jiva X to become liberated the knowledge that
it (jiva X) is sat chit ananda is a must. It is of no avail if jiva Y knows
that jiva X
is of this sat chit ananda nature. What the Lord and the Advaita Acharyas
are saying is that a jiva who reaches such lowly states will never be in a
position to know their true nature and get liberated. There is nothing
unadvaitic about this scriptural position. This position on these particular
jivas is as advaita-friendly as the karma theory is. In other words this
position is quite valid in the vyavaharika.

Regards,
subrahmanian.v




On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 5:19 PM, V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>wrote:

> ShrIgurubhyo namaH
>
> The Bhagavadgita, while holding that a discriminating human can reach the
> highest  state, which is none other than mokSha, absolute liberation, and
> never return to samsara, bondage, does have some verses that draw one's
> attention to some dreadful possibilities the jiva can land itself in.
>
> The Chapter 16, verses  18, 19 and 20 are worth studying in some detail.
> Here is the Translation of these verses along with the commentary of
> Shankaracharya:
>
>
>