[Advaita-l] Fw: On rationality; was "Vedas are not apauresheya according to the Vedas ?"

Ramesh Krishnamurthy rkmurthy at gmail.com
Tue Jan 29 21:44:56 CST 2013

Dear Sri Srinath Vedagarbha,

On 29 January 2013 04:07, Srinath Vedagarbha <svedagarbha at gmail.com> wrote:
> If we were to accept vEdAnta-pAribhAsha's definition of pramANa, the
> abAdhitvam is already factored into it (along with anadhigatatvam etc.).
> Now if you were to make pramANasiddha things as bAdhya, it goes against
> definition of pramANa as defined in VP.

Not at all. All the VP is saying is that any knowledge is valid until
it is negated. This also means that one remains open to the
possibility of it being negated.

The Atman, however, is not negatable at all - even the attempt to
negate it presumes it. Also, an advaitin ends up dismissing all
vyavahAra as mithyA, including all pramANa-s and pramAtRtvam itself.
If pramANasiddha entities were abAdhya, then you would end up in
dvaita, not advaita.

Note that abAdhya means "not negatable at all". It does not mean "not
negated as of now" or "yet to be negated".

> Also, from another angle, since the truth in your above stand is not svataH
> siddha as such, it can be considered as yet another pramEya in itself and
> begs for a pramANa.

Which stand are you talking about? My posts were about negating all
stands, not presenting a particular stand !!

<<No doubt Atman is svataHsiddha, but you need pramANa (shruti in this
case) to tell more about it -- such as making  aikya (identity)
statements of myself with Brahman etc. In this sense, not sure how you
shield advaita-vedanta from being a thesis.>>

Have already explained this before. The point is that the aikya
statements are not descriptions of any objective truths. Rather they
negate all objective notions about the Atman. For example, "tat tvam
asi" is essentially stating "you are limitless". Here "limitless" is
not an objective description of "you" but a negation of all limits
superimposed on "you". In other words, all that the shAstra is really
doing is to remind you that any objective description of you (Atman)
is bAdhya.

advaita-vedAnta does not present brahman as an objective reality.
Since advaita-vedAnta negates all that is negatable, which includes
all objective realities as well as all objective statements about the
Atman, it is not a thesis. Rather, it is a negation of all theses and
even the attempt to come up with any thesis.

Another way of saying this is - all theses are conditionally valid
(the primary condition being pramAtRtvam). The Atman alone is
unconditionally valid, and is presumed in any attempt to bring in
conditions and subsequent theses.

dhanyavAdaH :-)

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