[Advaita-l] Reply to Sri Vidyamanya Tirtha's observations

Sujal Upadhyay sujal.u at gmail.com
Thu Nov 14 07:23:50 CST 2013

Namaste Sri Venkatesh ji,

I was merely pointing stating that as on progresses in meditaton, he move
from 'effort to effortless'. I was not talking of final state. Please catch
the content and drop the container. That nAvika wa snot enjoying hukkA. It
was symbolic like I said above - from effort the effortless.

What I am saying is that Karma is for chitta Shuddhi, which can be done by
bhakti and nityA karma and ofcourse regular nidhidhyAsana.

If we talk about who is this 'I', then we will have to enter the realm of
ajAta vAda in which there is no nityA karma, no meditator, no yoga, no
prANAyama, etc. This is applicable to an advanced seeker who has already
burned all desires except one - 'I want moksha'.

Limited effort cannot produce limitless results. Why is sanyAsa Ashrama
considered the last and top most ashram from spiritual POV. Why it has been
told to drop nitya karma and to renounce agni (havans, etc), which
generally comes under kAmya karma.

Adi Shankara gives instructions from adhikAra bheda, so that each one of us
can gradually progress in spirituality.

sanyAsa is not a dishA, a way of life, it is mAnasika dashA, mental state.
A mumukshu can live in house and have renounced mentally everything and may
not even care about his body. But this renouncing of everything is not just
renouncing. There is something that is more precious compared to that which
is renounced. This is God. There is also mental purity that one can live
with bare minimum necessities. There is utmost faith in God, either one
surrenders his body to prArabhdha or to God. By saying that 'surrender to
prArabhdha' I mean to dis-associate with it and entirely neglecting it. But
how can one live without taking care of body. Dot we need to eat, bath,
wear clothes?. Is this not karma? One may ask such questions.

The answer is one does things that are *compulsory* and not for leisure. If
body demands food, one eats, but not over-eats if one has liking for
particular food. If eating one time is enough, skip the dinner. If one can
live on sattvik food like on fruits or milk, then even quit eating one time

But is this not karma and attachment with body.

The answer is No. Why? because prArabhdha karma is not an hindrance to
spiritual progress.

But how can one know that it is not an hindrance?

Simple. When you meditate, the issues which you had given importance will
pop up in mind and disturb the meditation. e.g. if you have attachment with
your daughter or son and if he is sick, you will see his face in
meditation. If he does not come in meditation, means that you are living
life spontaneously, as it happens, with no planning.

If you take initiative, then it is your own decision and not prArabhdha.
Lets take an example. If you want to write a commentary or translate Gita
bhAshya of our acharya and publish it as a book. This may look very noble,
but it is necessary for your spiritual progress? ask yourself. If it is not
and if it is your own initiative, then you are attached. How will you know
that you ar eattached? Suppose your plan fails and no one is ready to proof
read and publish your work or your work is not appreciated, then you will
feel a little low. This feeling of 'little low' is due to attachment.

If God has himself ordered you to write bhAshya or translate it or if your
Guru has ordered you, than all you have to do is to write it. Remember how
Adi shankara wrote Br. Sutra. bhAshya and then surrendered it to VyAsadev
and then wished to drop his mortal coil. He was ordered to write
commentary. He himself did not initiate it. He was not interested in
spreading it or having verbal debates. It was vyasadeva who ordered him to
do what he did. We all know what he did :) . When God gives you some task,
he also gives you sAmarthya' (ability). We see that Adi Shankara was given
another 16 years. He did not chose to live, but surrendered to prArabhdha.
It was at the command of lord (both Shiva and Vyasadeva) and his Guru that
he did what he did. If his life would not have been extended, would he be
able to do any work?

Sri Ramakrishna says that just getting inspiration and mentally assuming
that someone divine being is inspiring you to do some work and spread the
teaching is not enough. god himself must give darshan. When Ishvara is
behind you, he takes care of everything. There i no chance of failure of
divine plan.

Karma has to be done, but only that which is compulsory. When you actually
are detached from body (though not yet in advaita sthiti), still you will
not have any urge to do any work, but just live for God. There will be
mental isolation, even in the midst of the noisy of market. Indriya-s do
not hunt down anything. Sri Ramdas said, (in hindi), bhara bazara mein
thaa, per khariddara koi naa thaa', which means that when objects of sense
perception are available all around you, yet indriya-s do not hunt for

When you meditate more and more, you will drop all karmas except the ones
compulsory. In this case there is no question of doing nitya karma, as the
purpose of doing them as already been fulfilled. You have achieve inner

Karma cannot give moksha. Atman cannot be 'achieved'. In this race, the
winner is the one who is last. The one who withdraws from race and becomes
observer is the winner.

Karma-kand has it's own place. For proper functioning of society, each
ashram and each type of karma is equally important, but it is not the final
goal. without knowledge there is no mukti and mukti does not automatically
come as chitta is purified as one is still attached with body

To do any karma, one has to take aadhaara of body, and external objects,
which are gross. Mind is subtler than them. It is the mind that is we are
concerned and not karma or body. Body, which is already dead, is never
purified. It is the mind that is purified. We are concerned with mind and
not body or anything external. How can external gross things having no
independent existence can give you moksha. They are all under the influence
of mAyA. They are not capable of to transcend mAyA. Mind is also under the
influence of mAyA, but a suddha sAttvika mana has guNa of 'tyAga'. Only by
surrendering to that which transcends mAyA, is capable of taking one beyond
mAyA. That which transcends mAyA is none other than Brahman.

Brother, Karma, by nature is gross. It can in no way give give that which
is subtle than itself. Can you teach sanskrit if you do not know sanskrit?

Also note that whatever happens because of prArabhdha is very graceful and
mind calms down after the event is over. It is our perception and
interpretation that make us to act or react in a particular way, which
causes the whole mess.

I hoe members will get habituated for reading loooong responses ;)


Sujal Upadhyay

"To disconnect from the self and to become Aware of anything else is
nothing but unhappiness" - Bhagawan Ramana Maharshi

He who has faith has all
He who lacks faith, lacks all
It is the faith int he name of lord that works wonders

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