[Advaita-l] Maya and Sunrise Example

[kuntimaddi sadananda]

Sujal - Sun covered by clouds is an example Shankara uses in Atmabodha. The clouds are due to sun only and they appear to cover the sun for the person who is directly underneath - even though clouds can never cover the sun yet appears to be so- similarly ignorance. The clouds that are covering the sun is seen only due to the sunlight only. Similarly the ignorance apparently covering the self is known only because of the consciousness, which is the nature of the self. To see Sun clearly all I have to do is to remove the obstructing clouds. Thus when the wind blow away the clouds, the existent sun gets revealed in all his glory. I do not have to use any other means or pamaana to see the sun since sun is self-shining. Similarly when the ignorance is removed by the knowledge, the all illuminating self is self-revealed. I do not need any other means to see the self. 
This is Shankara's example.
Hari Om!
Sadananda


--------------------------------------------
On Sat, 1/25/14, Sujal Upadhyay <sujal.u at gmail.com> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] Maya and Sunrise Example
 To: "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
 Date: Saturday, January 25, 2014, 9:30 AM
 
 Namaste,
 
 We can take e.g. of Sun veiled by clouds to explain that
 Brahamn is never
 deluded, but it is still deluded:)
 
 Hari OM
 
 OM
 
 Sujal Upadhyay
 
 "To disconnect from the self and to become Aware of anything
 else is
 nothing but unhappiness" - Bhagawan Ramana Maharshi
 
 He who has faith has all
 He who lacks faith, lacks all
 It is the faith int he name of lord that works wonders
 FAITH IS LIFE, DOUBT IS DEATH - Sri Ramakrishna
 
 
 On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 7:25 PM, kuntimaddi sadananda <
 kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com>
 wrote:
 
 > Suresh - PraNAs
 >
 > These examples are given to make us understand the
 adhyaasa or errors  in
 > perception. There are two types of adhyaasa. 1. sa
 upaadhika and 2.
 > nirupaadika.
 >
 > The rope/snake and mirage water examples - both are
 given to illustrate
 > the problem. In the case of rope/snake - the error is
 praatibhaasika where
 > I seen it as snake while others do not or may not see
 the snake. snake is
 > projected because of saadrisyam or similarities in
 terms of attributes. The
 > attributes the senses gather depends on the capacity of
 the senses and also
 > the associated environmental conditions (light or
 darkness or
 > semi-darkness) etc. Hence the attributes are either
 incomplete or
 > inaccurate for my mind to recognize what I see as an
 object. I project the
 > snake from memory where there is a rope based on the
 partial attributes.
 > This is subject error of the object perceived. This
 comes under Jiiva
 > sRiShTi
 >
 > In the case of miraj water or even sun-rise, there is
 objective error of
 > the object perceived - the error is vyaavaahaarika.
 Here the error is not
 > due to incorrect sense perception but due to laws of
 nature that are beyond
 > the individual control. Hence everybody sees the mirage
 waters or sun-rise
 > and sun-set. In addition even after shastra says there
 is no sunrise and
 > sunset, and it is clearly understood, still we see and
 enjoy the sunrise
 > and sunset. That is the knowledge of the fact does not
 eliminate the
 > appearances. The same is seeing all the trees moving in
 opposite direction
 > when only when the train is moving forward. These come
 under Iswara sRiShTi.
 >
 > Both adhyaasas are relevant in advaita. One is the
 objective error and the
 > other is subjective error.
 >
 > When I understand that it is rope, then there is no
 more snake vision.
 > Similarly when I understand that I am Brahman, then
 there is no samsara or
 > emotional problems due to attachments. Jiiva sRishTi
 due to likes and
 > dislikes are eliminated. They will not come back just
 as snake will not
 > come back where the rope is.
 >
 > On the other hand adhyaasa due to the Iswara
 sRiShTi  will still be there
 > ever though I understood that it is not real - just as
 the sun-rise. A
 > jnaani still sees the world of plurality that is
 different from his local
 > BMI. Yes he understands the plurality is only
 appearance but not real just
 > as the sun rise or mirage waters or trees running
 backwards Hence the world
 > is recognized by a jnaani as mithyaa neither real nor
 unreal since it is
 > experienced - just like sun-rise and sun set.
 >
 > Hence both adhyaasas or errors in perception are
 applicable to understand
 > the truth underlying perceptions.
 >
 > Hope this helps
 > Hari Om!
 > Sadananda
 >
 >
 > --------------------------------------------
 > On Sat, 1/25/14, Suresh <mayavaadi at yahoo.com>
 wrote:
 >
 >  Subject: [Advaita-l] Maya and Sunrise Example
 >  To: "Advaita" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
 >  Date: Saturday, January 25, 2014, 7:51 AM
 >
 >  Friends,
 >
 >  Most people explain maya using the snake-rope
 example (or
 >  silver, mirage etc.), but wouldn't the sunrise
 example be
 >  better? Rope-snake example leads to the problem:
 there is an
 >  error in perception, which is later on corrected.
 In sunrise
 >  example, there is no error in perception.
 According to
 >  perception - which is never corrected - sun
 rises, period.
 >
 >
 >  Point is, the event called sunrise is false, yet
 we perceive
 >  it 100 times out of 100 .... establishing that
 even if
 >  perception isn't faulty, it still gives us wrong
 knowledge.
 >  Also that if something is perceived, it doesn't
 necessarily
 >  have to be true. Sunrise (jagat) is clearly
 perceived, yet
 >  it is false. Earth's movement (Brahman) is not
 perceived,
 >  yet it is true.
 >
 >
 >  So wouldn't the sunrise example be better in
 explaining
 >  maya, ignorance, and all the rest?
 >
 >
 >  Thanks,
 >  Suresh
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