[Advaita-l] 'world' is not the mental creation of tiny soul !!

[Bhaskar YR]

sAshtAnga praNAms Sri VidyA prabhuji
Hare Krishna

I am really happy to note that Sri Vidya prabhuji, my guruji, who has 
gracefully initiated the advaita vAsana in me, showing interest in my 
ramblings and asking me some questions.  Prabhuji, kindly pardon me if 
what your student of vedAnta saying below is not matching with the 
traditional stand of advaita. 

But, consider this. When you see pots and jugs as clay, do you see clay 
only,
or do you also see clay in the form of pot, clay in the form of jug, etc? 

>  prabhuji, mere looking at the pot as pot, jug as jug is not avidyA but 
seeing the pot, jug etc. as independent one from 'clay' is avidyA.  So, 
when the jnAni sees the jagat he sees the jagat as brahman only and not 
jagat as jagat independent of brahman.  prior to jnAna what has been seen 
as asarvaM, asatyaM etc. after the dawn of knowledge it becomes / realized 
as sarvaM satyam and there exists nothing but HIM.  And this is what has 
been said as Atmaikatva drushti / samyak drushti. 

If the latter, then you are lending some measure of reality to the vikAra, 
what is only vAcArambhaNa nAmadheya.

>  I dont think so prabhuji.  vAchAraMbhaNa nAmadheya in kArya rUpa 
(vikAra) would help us to know the sAmAnya in those vikAra.  We are not 
attributing any sort of reality to the vikAra since our intention is to 
realize the kAraNa behind this kArya vikAra. That is the reason why, 
shaunaka asks :  kasminnu bhagavO vijnAte sarvamidaM vijnAtaM bhavati?  If 
we know the kAraNa svarUpa (lOha, mruttike etc.) of  kArya, the kArya has 
been realized in its kAraNa svarUpa.  Example : If I know the cow-ness 
(gOtva / kAraNa) of the vikAra of nAma-rUpa of various cows, that 
vAchAraMbhaNa nAmadheya  hardly disturbs me as a reality.  And this kArya 
is there for us to know that behind all these vikAra there is ONLY ONE 
sAmAnya.  vAchAraMbhaNAm, vAgAlambanaM, vAgArambhaNaM ityetat.  These are 
all nAmadheya-s mere nomenclature, there to teach us the kAraNa.   And 
through this nomenclature only we can be able to realize that brahman is 
all this and at the same time nirupAdhika as well clarifies shankara in 
bruhadAraNyaka : yadi hi nAmarUpe na vyAkreeyate tadA asyAtmanO 
nirupAdhikaM rUpaM prajnAnaghanAkhyaM na pratikhyAyeta.  Though these nAma 
rUpa on its own not at all satya, these nAma rUpa-s are satya only in its 
kAraNa svarUpa...mruttiketyeva satyaM, vAchAraMbhaNaM vikArO nAmadheyaM. 

 In other words, is it possible to have a perception of jugs and pots 
after the real nature as clay is known? 

>  jnAni's jnAna is not any avasthAteeta or restricted to one particular 
state or vyavahAra abhAva jnAna prabhuji. 
 
Yet, just like in the rope-snake analogy, ignorance of the real nature of 
brahman
(as avikArI) is what gives rise to the jagat perception, full of vikAra, 
in the first
place. kasyeyam avidyA?


>  but jagat is NOT like snake on rOpe this is what shankara clarifies in 
chAndOgya (6.2.3) :  To the question: asadeva tarhi sarvaM yadgruhyate 
rajjuriva sarpAdyAkAreNa??  shankara answers:  NA !! sata eva 
dvaitabhedena anyathAgruhyamANAtvAt na asatyaM kasyachit kvachit iti 
bhrUmaH.  Subsequent clarification in the same bhAshya by shankara would 
help us to know that jagat as an independent one is asat but jagat as in 
its kAraNa rUpa satyameva. 
 
If you say that the jnAnI sees the avikArI brahman even when s/he sees the
jagat that is full of vikAra, you will eventually devolve to the 
avidyA-leSa or
vAsanA or saMskAra mode of explanation.

>  bAhyAkArabhedabuddhinivruttireva AtmasvarUpAvalambanakAraNaM says 
bhagavatpAda in geeta bhAshya.  prabhuji you only clarified guNA guNeshu 
vartante etc.  here jnAni does not do anything since he is neither kartru 
nor bhOktru.  sarvAtma bhAvO mOkshO vidyAphalaM kriyAkAraka phala 
shUnyaM...yatra avidyAdi kArma karmaNi na santi clarifies shankara in 
bruhad bhAshya.  It would be better if we understand advaita jnAna is all 
about : bAhyAkAra bedha buddhi nivrutti and it is NOT bAhyAkAra 
nivrutti...jnApakaM hi shAstraM na tu kArakaM...jnAna does not annihilate 
anything, jnAni only reveals the truth behind what is there already 
existing. 
 
If you say that the jnAnI does not see the vikAra of jagat at all, and 
sees only
brahman, niravayava, nirviSesha, nirguNa, nirvikAra, then you will veer to 
the
jnAna happens in nirvikalpa samAdhi mode of explanation.

>  prabhuji kindly see above. 
 
Neither of these is acceptable to the paksha that insists that avidyA is 
purely
subjective, pertaining to the jIva only, not brahman, and is purely an 
absence.

>  Kindly pardon me prabhuji.  I am not able to understand this clearly 
with the purported intention of your goodself.  Do you mean to say here 
avidyA pertains to brahman and not to jeeva?? 

sAshtAnga praNAms once again prabhuji,
Your humble servant
Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
bhaskar