[Advaita-l] JAGAT MITHYATVAM IN ADVAITA - A CONCLUSION - part -1

[Sunil Bhattacharjya]

Sorry friends,

There was a typo. Please read <Bhagavad Gita : II-19>  as  <The Original Bhagavad Gita : II-19>

Thanks and regards,


--------------------------------------------
On Thu, 4/28/16, Sunil Bhattacharjya via Advaita-l <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] JAGAT MITHYATVAM IN ADVAITA - A CONCLUSION - part -1
 To: "Bhaskar YR" <bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com>, "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>, "V Subrahmanian" <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
 Date: Thursday, April 28, 2016, 1:59 PM
 
 Namaste,
 
 The Ajativada verse in Bhagavad Gita II-19 , which is the
 same as used by Gaudapada in Mandukya-karika II-6, says it
 all that there has been the Brahman alone in the beginning
 and He alone is at the end and there is none else in
 between. So all the Jagat as experienced under the influence
 of Maya vanishes the moment one gets out of the grip of
 Maya.  Thus the reality of Jagat is untenable and it is
 best said by calling the Jagat as Mithya. However,this is
 easier said than realized, while remaining within the world
 of Maya. Only the sthitaprajna, who is able to control the
 mind to desist desires of the senses, and does the Manana
 and Dhyana, (i.e.,in the yoga-yukta state) can get truly
 convinced of this truth.
 
 Regards,
 Sunil KB
 
 Regards,
 Sunil KB
 
 
 
 --------------------------------------------
 On Thu, 4/28/16, V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
 wrote:
 
  Subject: Re: [Advaita-l] JAGAT MITHYATVAM IN ADVAITA - A
 CONCLUSION - part -1
  To: "Bhaskar YR" <bhaskar.yr at in.abb.com>,
 "A discussion group for Advaita Vedanta" <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
  Date: Thursday, April 28, 2016, 11:00 AM
  
  On Thu, Apr 28, 2016 at
  3:45 PM, Bhaskar YR via Advaita-l <
  advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org>
  wrote:
  
  > praNAms
  > Hare Krishna
  >
  > First of all, before quoting the shruti
  and bhAshyakAra, I would like to
  > quote
  couple of references from my parama guruji Sri SSS from
 one
  of his
  > articles published in 2014 from
  adhyAtma prakAsha kAryAlaya in monthly
  >
  magazine adhyAtma prakAsha and another one from his minor
  work 'brahma
  > vidyA'.  I am
  just reproducing the first one i.e. article in adhyAtma
  > prakAsha  as it is written in Kannada 
  :
  >
  > // quote //
  >
  > haagaadare
  tattvajnAnavAdamelAdarU prapanchavu mithyeyendu tOruvudO
  illavO
  > ??  Aga mAtra idu mithyeyaagi
  tOralu kAraNavenu??  endu yaaraadaru shankisa
  > bahudu.  idakke uttaravenendare,
  nijavaagi yaavaagalu prapanchavu
  >
  mithyavendu kaaNisuvude illa.  ekendare Atmanannu bittare
  prapanchavembudu
  > bereyaagi
  iruvudilla.  ajnAnigaLige avara paramAtma svarUpavu
  tiLiyadu.
  > Addarinda avaru
  bhinabhinnaraagiruva jeevarugaLannu alli avarugaLu
  > vyavaharisuttiruva prapanchavannu
  kaaNuttiruttaare.  Adare avaru
  >
  AtmasAkshAtkAravannu padedare " idellavu Atmane"
  emba shrutiya arthavannu
  >
  managANuttaare.  Aga avarige prapanchavu Atmane Agi
  biduvudarinda adu
  > paramasatyavaagi
  biduttade.
  >
  >
  Addarinda "jagattu mithyeye?? "?  emba prashnege
  katta kadeya uttaravu
  > yaavadaayitu?? 
  adu taaniruva paramArtha rUpadalli Atmane, brahmave.
  > Addarinda adu nijavaagiye satyavaagide
  hIge nOdidare yaavadondU mithyave
  >
  alla.  ajnAnigaLige tOruttiruva brahma bhinnavaada
  jagattembudu illave
  > illa; Addarinda
  adannu satyavendaagali, mithyavendaagali vingadisuvudakke
  > kaaraNavilla.
  
  
  
  The above
  conclusion is contradicted by Shankara, in BGB 2.16 end:
  
  त्वमपि
  तत्त्वदर्शिनां
  दृष्टिमाश्रित्य शोकं
  मोहं च हित्वा
  शीतोष्णादीनि
  नियतानियतरूपाणि
  द्वन्द्वानि
  *विकारोऽयमसन्नेव
  मरीचिजलवन्मिथ्यावभासते
  *इति
  मनसि
  निश्चित्य तितिक्षस्व
  इत्यभिप्रायः।।
  
  Translation by Swami
  Gambhirananda:
  
  Therefore,
  you too, by adopting *the vision of the men of realization
  *and
  giving up sorrow and delusion, forbear
  the dualities, heat, cold, etc. some
  of
  which are definite in their nature, and others inconstant
 ,
  mentally
  being convinced that this
  (phenomenal world) is changeful, *verily unreal
  and appears falsely like water in a
  mirage.//*
  
  The Kannada
  translation of the above line of the bhashyam by Sri SSS:
  
  //nīnū antaḥ
  tattvadarśigaḷa dṛṣṭīyannu āśrayisikoṇḍu
  śokavannū mohavannū
  biṭṭu
  śītosṇagaḷu muntāda niyatarūpavāgiyū
  aniyatarūpavāgiyū iruva
  dvandagaḷannu
  'idu kāryavāddarinda bisilukudureya nīrinante asatte
  āgiddu
  husiyāgi toruttide' endu
  manassinalli niścayisikoṇḍu taḍeduko endu
  abhiprāya.//
  
  Sri SSS has very correctly translated the
  bhashya: the way in which the
  Jnani sees the
  world, its transformations: as the mirage water even
  though
  non-existent, asat, yet appears
  unreal. The Kannada word for that is
  'husiyāgi toruvudu'.  So, according
  to the translation, the Jnani will see
  the
  world, its transformations, as a mere appearance, knowing
  that it does
  not exist really.
  
  Someone can kindly reproduce
  here Sri SSS's translation for  the following
  bhashya sentences too, especially the 4.1.19
  BSB.
  
  
  In
  the BSB 4.1.15 Shankara clearly says:
  
  बाधितमपि तु
  मिथ्याज्ञानं
  द्विचन्द्रज्ञानवत्संस्कारवशात्कंचित्कालमनुवर्तत
  एव
  ।
  [Even after
  having been annulled, sublated, the mithyājnānam,
  false-knowledge, like the two-moon perception,
  will certainly continue for
  some time.]
  BSB 4.1.19
  
  ननु सत्यपि
  सम्यग्दर्शने यथा
  प्राग्देहपाताद्भेददर्शनं
  द्विचन्द्रदर्शनन्यायेनानुवृत्तम्,
  एवं
  पश्चादप्यनुवर्तेत —
 न,
  निमित्ताभवात् ।
  Objection:  Even when the right realization is
  there, just as perception of
  difference,
  bheda darshanam, persists till the fall of the body (of
  the
  Jnani), let it (perception of bheda)
  continue even after death?
  [For this
  objection Shankara answers,
  उपभोगशेषक्षपणं हि
  तत्रानुवृत्तिनिमित्तम्,
  न च तादृशमत्र
  किञ्चिदस्ति । [The exhaustion of
  experience of prarabdha  alone is the limit
  for such continuance (of bheda
  darshanam).
  Such prarabdha is no longer there after the body falls.
  Thus, Shankara explicitly says that the Jnani
  perceives the mithyā world,
  with the
  knowledge that it is mithya.  That is why he is giving
 the
  analogy
  of (1) the mirage water - where the
  water appearance is continuing to be
  perceived but the knowledge that it is mithya
  is also there and (2) the
  two-moon
  perception where owing to an ocular disease, a person
  perceives
  two moons while he knows that it
  is only one.  These two analogies, for
  Shankara, are to explain the state of the
  Jnani's perception of the world
  of
  multiplicity, while he knows that it is mithyā.
  
  This topic was discussed long
  ago, in 2009, and an article available here
  was the outcome of that:
  https://adbhutam.wordpress.com/2009/07/30/the-enlightened-eminently-engage-in-empirical-endeavours/
  
  regards
  vs
  
  
  > jagattendaadaru kareyiri,
  brahmavendaadaru kareyiri; iruvudu Onde Ondu
  > adviteeyavAda paramArtha satyavu. 
  adakkinta bereyaagi yaavadondU iruvade
  >
  illa.
  >
  > // unquote
  //
  >
  > Those who can
  read and understand Kannada, above two paragraphs are
  > self-explanatory.  And those who donot
  know Kannada the gist of above
  >
  observation of Sri SSS is about  jnAni's perception of
  jagat after the
  > svarUpa jnana.  Sri
  SSS poses a question here : After realization whether
  > this jagat become mithyA for the jnAni?? 
  And why this jagat would become
  > mithyA
  for the jnAni only after realization??  For this Sri SSS
  clarifies :
  > THERE IS NOTHING LIKE
  MITHYA PRAPANCHA AT ANY POINT OF TIME  because
  > prapancha (jagat) does not deviate from
  brahman and does not exist apart
  > from
  brahman.  Only ajnAni-s due to their parichinna jnana
 would
  see the
  > various jeeva-s and manifold
  objects and transactions.  When they realize
  > they would come to know that 'all this
  is Atman only'.  Therefore, Sri SSS
  > in second pyara concludes :  For the
  question : is this jagat mithyA??  The
  >
  ultimate answer is :  that (jagat) in its sadrUpa
  (paramArtha rUpa) Atman
  > only brahman
  only.  Therefore this (jagat) is REAL, FOR THAT MATTER
  THERE
  > IS NOTHING THAT CAN BE CALLED 
  'MITHYA'.  For the ajnAni-s this jagat would
  > appear bhinna from brahman (separate from
  brahman), that which does not
  > exist at
  all.  Therefore no need for exercise like
 tattvAnyatvAbhyAm
  for
  > this avidyA kalpita jagat. 
  Whether you call this jagat or brahman what is
  > there is ONLY one and that is paramArtha
  satya there exists nothing apart
  > from
  it.
  >
  > And Sri SSS
  further clarifies in brahma vidye (again a Kannada book)
  at
  > the end quotes one shruti vAkya :
  brahma dAshA brahma dAsA brahmaiveme
  >
  kitavAH and advises that realization of this universal
 truth
  (sarvatrika
  > satya) is the parama
  purushArtha jnana, janma sAphalya jnana.  Those who
  > attain this jnana is dvija Sri SSS quotes
  manu here.
  >
  > And in
  his various prakaraNa works like jeevanta vedAnta,
  anubhava
  > paryanta vedAnta, mAndUkya
  rahasya vivruttiH, shAnkara vedAnta,
  >
  Misconceptions about shankara vedAnta etc.  Sri SSS deals
  with this subject
  > and clarifies that
  sarvAtmakatvaM is what is advocated in shankara's
  > Advaita vedAnta and jagan mithyatvaM is
  not an essential criterial to
  > arrive
  this truth.
  >
  > In the
  next part we shall look into the shruti and shankara
 bhAshya
  (
  > which I have already covered in my
  previous mails) to this effect.
  >
  > Hari Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
  > bhaskar
  >
  >
  >
  >
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