[Advaita-l] Shankara and DrishTi-SrishTi vAda - eka jeeva vaada

[Venkatraghavan S]

Thanks Sri Chandrmouliji.

I am copying a footnote from Ch 6 of VichArasAgara that talks about DSV
and eka jIvatva implied by it (Pg 224):

अत्र अयं अभिप्रायः - अस्मिन् दृष्टिसृष्टिवादे "ब्रह्म वा इदमग्रासीत् ।
तदात्मानम् एव आवेत् । अहम् ब्रह्मास्मीति ।" (बृ १-४-१०) इत्यादिश्रुत्या,
"ब्रह्मैव स्वाविद्यया संसरति स्वविद्यया मुच्यते च" इति बृहदारण्यकभाष्यात्,
"व्याधसूनोः स्मृतिप्राप्तौ व्याधभावो निवर्तते ।
यथैवमात्मानो$ज्ञस्य तत्त्वमस्यादिवाक्यतः॥"
इत्यादिवार्तिकाच्च स्वाविद्यया जीवभावमापन्नस्य **ब्रह्मण एकत्वादेक एव
जीवो$ङ्गीक्रियते* *।
**अन्यजीवरूपगुरुशिष्ययोरङ्गीकारो नास्त्येव** । किन्तु
स्वप्नगतैकमुख्यजीवाद्भिन्ना अन्ये जीवाभासा यथा प्रतीयन्ते, तथैवाभासरूपाः
गुरुशिष्यादयः प्रतिभान्ति ।

Here VAsudeva Brahmendra Sarasvati, in commenting on VichArasAgara, says
that following Br. 1.4.10, it's BhAshya and Vartika, it becomes apparent
that the one Brahman takes itself to be the jIva through self ignorance,
and as a consequence, jIva is one too (in this vAda). Other jivas, guru,
shishya etc are not accepted - like how in a dream, other jIva's apart from
the one dreaming are just appearances to the dreamer, in the waking state
too other jIvas like guru, shishyas are appearances.

Regards,
Venkatraghavan
On 7 May 2016 1:11 p.m., "H S Chandramouli" <hschandramouli at gmail.com>
wrote:

> The talks can be downloaded from following link
>
> << https://www.mediafire.com/folder/7cgw5m9kew41j/Vichara_sagaram >>
>
> I presume the link is still active.
>
> Regards
>
> On Sat, May 7, 2016 at 5:33 PM, H S Chandramouli <hschandramouli at gmail.com
> > wrote:
>
>> For those interested further on the subject of Drishti Srishti vAda,  Sri
>> Paramarthananda Swamiji has covered it exhaustively and exclusively in
>> talks nos 72 to 74 on Vichara Sagara.
>>
>> For information.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> On Sat, May 7, 2016 at 5:06 PM, Venkatraghavan S via Advaita-l <
>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Namaste Sadaji,
>>> Thank you so much for sharing your conversation with Swamiji. I believe
>>> DSV
>>> does imply eka jIva vAda. However what that eka jIva is, is the crux
>>> here.
>>>
>>> My understanding of this vAda is that it is the one kAraNa sharIra that
>>> "creates" the world as it were. It is not what the vjnAna vAdi considers
>>> as
>>> the mind that is the jagat kartA.
>>>
>>> However, the appearance of several jIvAs  is also a product of that one
>>> kAraNa sharIra only. Hence, my understanding is that it is that kAraNa
>>> sharIra limited chaitanyam that is the eka jIva in Drishti Srishti vAda.
>>>
>>> I remember Swamiji saying this (that it is the kAraNa sharIra that is the
>>> srishti kartA, not the mind) when introducing drishti srishti in
>>> Vicharasagara.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Venkatraghavan
>>> On 7 May 2016 11:58 a.m., "kuntimaddi sadananda" <
>>> kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > PraNAms
>>> >
>>> > The discussion is shifting from DSV - SDV to Ekajeeva vaada vs aneka
>>> jeeva
>>> > vaada, and this topic was discussed by Shree Subbuji in the past. At
>>> that
>>> > time I had some discussions with Swami Paramarthanandaji on this
>>> topic. I
>>> > am re-posting my understanding based on that discussion with Swamiji.
>>> >
>>> > Related to the Ekajeeva vaaada vs aneka jeeva vaada - I think Shree
>>> > Bhaskarji is right, this time!
>>> >
>>> > Here is my understanding:
>>> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >
>>> > Eka jiiva vaada
>>> >
>>> > First – an acknowledgement – this current writing is prompted by the
>>> posts
>>> > on creation and cognition by local tiny jiiva based on Bhagavatam
>>> (Uddhava
>>> > Geeta) sloka, with many indirect supportive teachings by Shree
>>> Subbuji. .
>>> > Yesterday, I had a chance to discuss this issue with Shree Swami
>>> > Paramarthanandaji about the jest of the eka-jiiva vaada. Since Swamiji
>>> is
>>> > not a member of any list, I would paraphrase this write-up as my
>>> > understanding of what Swamiji discussed. Needless to say, that it is
>>> left
>>> > to the reader to accept or reject the statements.
>>> > There was a consideration that creation involves only one jiiva, the
>>> > subject and the other entities constituting the world forming the
>>> objects
>>> > of his cognition. Ignorance of that jiiva involves parichchinnatvam or
>>> > notion of limitation that I am only this body, mind and intellect,
>>> while
>>> > the rest of the creation constitutes objects of his cognition. As
>>> usual,
>>> > samsaara or suffering comes by giving absolute reality to the cognized
>>> > world of plurality. Teaching to that jiiva is that whatever that is
>>> > cognized is not really real but mithyaa; since whatever cognized is
>>> inert
>>> > and there cannot be any real inert entities since consciousness is
>>> infinite
>>> > – prajnaanam brahma.
>>> >
>>> > Here we need to recognize three aspects that are involved in this
>>> model;
>>> > a) creation of plurality b) cognition of that plurality by senses c)
>>> > teaching to that jiiva that any cognized entity is not real.
>>> Realization,
>>> > as usual, involves recognition that I am Brahman, and anything else is
>>> > naama rupa mithyaa, and I am the substratum even for the mithyaa world
>>> of
>>> > plurality.
>>> >
>>> > There are several concerns and questions that arise from this model.
>>> Some
>>> > of them, were discussed in the past. These include a) jiiva creating
>>> the
>>> > world of plurality and then cognizing what he has created, and assuming
>>> > that the world of plurality that is cognized in real. To that jiiva
>>> there
>>> > is a teaching that it is not real but mithyaa.
>>> >
>>> > 1) First concern that comes up is if he is the creator and then
>>> cognizing
>>> > the creation, the teaching does not differ from vijnaana vaada of
>>> Buddhism.
>>> >
>>> > 2) Second concern is if he is the creator of the whole universe, he
>>> must
>>> > be sarva jnana or all knower, since creation requires the whole
>>> knowledge
>>> > of creation. He has to create from himself – that is he has to be
>>> abhinna
>>> > nimitta upaadana kaaraNa of the universe – that is both material and
>>> > intelligent cause for the universe. If so he is taking the role of
>>> Iswara
>>> > of that creation while being a local tiny jiiva.
>>> >
>>> > 3) Being the material cause also, he is the adhiShTaanam of the
>>> universe
>>> > too – here we are not referring to sat chit ananda swaruupa aatma but
>>> eka
>>> > jiiva of that creation since in this model he is the creator.
>>> >
>>> > 4) Another concern is creation should take place after he became a tiny
>>> > jiiva since the model involves the creation and cognition by the tiny
>>> jiiva
>>> > who has to be pre-existing before creation starts.
>>> >
>>> > 5) The item 4 leads to anyonya aashraya dosha or mutual dependency,
>>> like A
>>> > depends on B and B depends of A – This is because the jiiva has to be
>>> > created first for him to create the rest that includes in BMI which is
>>> part
>>> > of cognized world. Jiiva hood itself is due to identification with
>>> upAdhis,
>>> > BMI, as I am this. Thus he creates himself to create the rest
>>> including his
>>> > BMI for him to cognize.
>>> >
>>> > 6) He must have become ignorant after he created the universe, that
>>> makes
>>> > the ignorance to have beginning. Knowledgeable person cannot become
>>> > ignorant. If he becomes, then there is no question of moksha for him
>>> since
>>> > he can always become ignorant even after gaining knowledge. It is an
>>> > eternal struggle.
>>> >
>>> > 7) Next important concern is who the teacher for this single jiiva is.
>>> > Non-jiiva cannot teach and there is no other jiiva, even for him to
>>> realize
>>> > and then teach.
>>> >
>>> > I recognize some of the concerns are interdependent but I am only
>>> > highlighting them to recognize the problems that one encounters. The
>>> basic
>>> > problem is statement that he creates and then cognizes.
>>> >
>>> > Because of the limited time encounter, Swamiji answered briefly my
>>> > concerns grasping the essence of them. He said in the deep sleep state
>>> > there is only kaaraNa shariira which is essentially ignorance of all
>>> > duality as we discussed in the series – who slept well?. The ignorance
>>> > being undifferentiated, since there is no duality, the ignorance at
>>> both
>>> > individual level and collective level is one homogenous ignorance.
>>> From the
>>> > collective point it is called maayaa, which is nothing but parameswara
>>> > Shakti. Hence in Madukya aagama prakarana the kaaraNa state is also
>>> defined
>>> > from the macro scale as Iswara. Creation is by that Iswara and not by
>>> the
>>> > local mind of the jiiva, even in the eka jiiva vaada – the reason, he
>>> said,
>>> > is that even the local mind has to be created. We are back to the
>>> original
>>> > theory that creation is not by the local jiiva but by Iswara who is
>>> > sarvajna and sarva Shaktimaan.
>>> >
>>> > Eka jiiva comes from the point that there is only one subject from his
>>> > perspective and everything he cognizes is object of his perception. The
>>> > teaching he receives is also via his sense perception and his
>>> cognition and
>>> > therefore objectifiable entity. To the question that who is the teacher
>>> > then, he just smiled and says your guess is as good as mine. He
>>> > categorically denied that it is not that local jiiva creates and then
>>> > cognizes since the cognitive instruments need to be created too. He
>>> agreed
>>> > that if we accept creation and then cognition by that jiiva, then it
>>> will
>>> > not be different from vijnana vaada of Buddhism.
>>> >
>>> > I left him since there were others in line seeking his attention.
>>> > .
>>> > With prostrations to Shree Swamiji for educating me on this topic.
>>> >
>>> > Hari Om!
>>> > Sadananda
>>> >
>>> >
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>>
>>
>