[Advaita-l] Any new posts on Sringeri Days?

[V Subrahmanian]

On Thu, Jun 28, 2018 at 11:22 PM, Kalyan <kalyan_kg at yahoo.com> wrote:

> //In fact the akasha example was given to show that just as akasha is
> really not limited by the pot-upadhis, Brahman is not tainted by the
> body-mind upadhis. //
>
>
> If the above is the position, then it is not correct to say that brahman
> is affected by avidya or ignorance.
>

What is meant is: 'Brahman is 'as though' affected by avidya.'  The
standard statement that encapsulates of Advaita is:   'ब्रह्मैव स्वाविद्यया
संसरतीव, स्वविद्यया मुच्यत इव '  [Brahman alone, owing to its own avidya,
is as though bound and due to vidya of itself, is as though released.]
That is why in Advaita the realization is not of the order: 'I was bound
till now and henceforth I am liberated.' On the other hand, the realization
of the liberated man is articulated by Shankara thus:

  पूर्वसिद्धकर्तृत्वभोक्तृत्वविपरीतं हि त्रिष्वपि
कालेष्वकर्तृत्वाभोक्तृत्वस्वरूपं ब्रह्माहमस्मि,नेतः पूर्वमपि कर्ता भोक्ता
वा अहमासम्, नेदानीम्, नापि भविष्यत्काले — इति ब्रह्मविदवगच्छति ; एवमेव च
मोक्ष उपपद्यते ; ४.१.२३. इति ।

[Contrary to the previous thinking that I am doer-enjoyer, *in all the
three periods of time I am Brahman that is neither doer nor enjoyer*.
Before, I was not doer-enjoyer, nor now, nor even in the future will I be
doer-enjoyer - such is the realization of a Knower.] BSB 4.1.23.

 Coming to // then it is not correct to say that brahman is affected by
avidya or ignorance.// Since the Upanishad BU 1.4.10 says 'It was Brahman
(even before this realization). It now realized its nature as 'I am
Brahman' and thereby it 'became' all, the need to posit a state of
ignorance in order to explain the pre-realization experience of bondage.

Shankara has cited a verse in the VSN Bhashya to the same effect:

स्वमायया स्वमात्मानं मोहयन्द्वैतमायया । गुणाहितं स्वमात्मानं लभते च स्वयं
हरिः ॥ [By his own Māyā, deluding himself with the illusion of dvaita, Hari
Himself comes to see himself endowed with guṇas.]
In the Puruṣasūkta bhāṣya, Sāyaṇācārya cites the Nrsimha Uttara Tapini
Upanishad to the same effect:

 एतच्चाथर्वाणिका उत्तरतापनीये स्पष्टमामनन्ति - स वा एष भूतानीन्द्रियाणि
विराजं देवताः कोशांश्च सृष्ट्वा प्रविश्यामूढो मूढ इव व्यवहरन्नास्ते माययैव
। इति । .

This is clearly stated by the Nṛsimha uttara tāpanīya Upaniṣad: He indeed
created all these beings - virāt, the devatā-s and the pancha kośā-s and
entering them, though himself beyond delusion, appears, out of māyā, doing
his actions, as though he is deluded.

  vs

>
>
> On Thursday, June 28, 2018, 11:10:48 PM GMT+5:30, V Subrahmanian <
> v.subrahmanian at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 28, 2018 at 10:42 PM, Kalyan via Advaita-l <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> //Just like one mahAkAsha can have as many ghaTa-upAdhis and become
> those many ghaTAkAshas, so can one brahman be associated with as many
> avidyA-upAdhis and become those many jIvas//In this case, nobody can
> attain liberation until all jIvas have attained liberation since even if
> one set of upAdhis are removed, other sets of upAdhis that limit brahman
> still exist.
>
>
> The defect in the above conclusion is: While the case of akasha is 'real',
> the case with Brahman is not so. Brahman is infinite, that is the
> adhishThaanam for akasha even. Also, the Brahma sutra, the Purusha sukta,
> etc. clearly say 'it is not that Brahman 'in its entirety' has become the
> world; only one fourth is this creation and three fourths stands 10 inches
> above creation, untouched by the latter. [Sayana has clarified that the
> part-idea is only to convey that Brahman is untouched by creation.] So, the
> premise of the above conclusion does not depict the actual picture of
> Advaita.  Even in the case of Akasha there is no real limitation caused to
> akasha due to the pot-enclosures. In the BG 13.15:
>
> बहिरन्तश्च भूतानामचरं चरमेव च ।
> सूक्ष्मत्वात्तदविज्ञेयं दूरस्थं चान्तिके च तत् ॥ १५ ॥
>
> Shankara has said Atman/Brahman pervades both the inside and outside of
> all beings.   What about the middle? Even that is pervaded by Atman.
>
> In fact the akasha example was given to show that just as akasha is really
> not limited by the pot-upadhis, Brahman is not tainted by the body-mind
> upadhis.
>
>
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