[Advaita-l] The Foundations of Adhyāsa - 8 (The Three States)

[Venkatesh Murthy]

Namaste

It is not correct  if Jnani can see Waking condition is unreal when he is
in Waking but he cannot see Dream is unreal when he is in Dream. Because he
has constant awareness of Tureeya in all three states. The Tureeya
awareness will not disappear in all three states and will be constantly
with him.

On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 12:54 PM H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 11:26 PM V Subrahmanian <v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> << Since the realization 'I am all', sarvoham' arises ONLY by the
> falsification of the objective world, mithyatva nishchaya', the above
> Mantra and Bhashya is the proof of the Jnani relizing even in dream that
> the world is mithya. >>.
>
> I am not so sure. I think what the mantra and bhashya are stating is that
> in the dream state also, the jnAni dreams that he is a jnAni and not that
> he is being chased by elephants etc which the ajnAnIs normally dream. The
> mantra and bhashya do not state that the jnAni is aware of the dream to be
> unreal when he is in the dream state.
>
> Part of translation of same bhashya by Swami Madhavananda   << Then when
> ignorance and knowledge increases, ( the result is as follows ). The text
> describes the content and nature of the knowledge : *And when* he himself
> becomes *a god, as it were*. When, in the waking state, meditation
> regarding the gods prevails, he considers himself a god, as it were, on
> account of the impressions generated by it. The same thing is being said of
> the dream state too : He becomes  ‘a god, as it were.’  *Or a king, as it
> were* : Having been installed as the ruler of a state ( in the waking state
> ), he thinks in his dreams also that he is a king. For he is imbued with
> the impressions of his kingly state. Similarly, when ( in the waking state)
> his ignorance is extremely attenuated, and the knowledge that he comprises
> all arises, he *thinks* under the influence of these impressions in the
> dream state also, ‘*This (*universe*) is myself, who am all.’** >>*
>
> Regards
>
> On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:58 AM Ravi Kiran <ravikiranm108 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > Thank you Subbuji for pointing to the precise and relevant  bhAshya texts
> > and summary,
> >
> > This helps much!
> >
> > Warm regards,
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 11:26 PM V Subrahmanian <
> v.subrahmanian at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Nov 19, 2018 at 8:52 AM Ravi Kiran via Advaita-l <
> >> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Namaste,
> >>>
> >>> A small clarification:
> >>>
> >>> On Sun, Nov 18, 2018 at 9:42 AM H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l <
> >>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > Namaste Kartik Ji,
> >>> >
> >>> > Reg  << So it appears that although a Jnani may have so-called
> >>> "waking" or
> >>> > "dream" states, there is a
> >>> > big difference in his case that the UNDERLYING Turiya state is never
> >>> > "forgotten". In other
> >>> > words, the Jnani does not have the *Adhyasa* of confusing the
> "waking"
> >>> or
> >>> > "dream" to be real! >>,
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>> does a Jnani know the dream to be unreal while in dream ? ( in other
> >>> words,
> >>> the Turiya Jnana attained in waking continues to be available during
> >>> dream state also ? )
> >>>
> >>
> >> Brihadaranyaka mantra: 4.3.20:
> >>
> >> ता वा अस्यैता हिता नाम नाड्यो यथा केशः सहस्रधा भिन्नस्तावताणिम्ना
> >> तिष्ठन्ति शुक्लस्य नीलस्य पिङ्गलस्य हरितस्य लोहितस्य पूर्णा अथ यत्रैनं
> >> घ्नन्तीव जिनन्तीव हस्तीव विच्छाययति गर्तमिवपतति यदेव जाग्रद्भयं पश्यति
> >> तदत्राविद्यया मन्यतेऽथ यत्र देव इव राजेवाहमेवेदं सर्वोऽस्मीति मन्यते
> >> सोऽस्य परमो लोकः ॥ २० ॥
> >>
> >> //Now, when  he feels as if he were being killed or overpowered, or
> >> being  chased by an elephant, or falling into a pit, in short, when he
> >> fancies at that time, thorough ignorance, whatever frightful  thing he
> has
> >> expericned in the waking state, that is the dream  state. So also, when
> he
> >> thinks he is a god, as it were, or a king,  as it were, or thinks: "This
> >> universe is myself and I am all,: that  is his highest state.  //
> >>
> >> Shankara's bhashya, the relevant portion:
> >>
> >> एवम् अत्यन्तप्रक्षीयमाणा अविद्या उद्भूता च विद्या सर्वात्मविषया यदा, तदा
> >> स्वप्नेऽपि तद्भावभावितः — अहमेवेदं सर्वोऽस्मीति मन्यते ; स यः
> >> सर्वात्मभावः, सोऽस्य आत्मनः परमो लोकः परम आत्मभावः स्वाभाविकः ।
> Br.Up.4.3.20
> >>
> >>
> >> [Then when ignorance decreases and knowledge'
> >> increases, (the result is as follows). The text describes
> >> the content and nature of the knowledge: And when
> >> he himself becomes a god, as it were.· When, in the
> >> waking state, meditation regarding the gods prevails.
> >> he considers himself a god, as it were, on account of
> >> the impressions generated by it. The same thing is
> >> being said of the dream state too: He becomes 'a god,
> >> as it were.' Or a king, as it were : Having been
> >> installed as the ruler of a state (in the waking state).
> >> he thinks in his dreams also that he is a king, for he
> >> is imbued with the impressions of his kingly state.
> >> *Similarly, when (in the waking state) his ignorance is*
> >> *extremely attenuated, and the knowledge that he*
> >> *comprises all arises, he thinks under the influence of*
> >> *these impressions in the dream state also, 'This*
> >> *(universe) is myself, who am all.' That, this identity*
> >> *with all, is his highest state, the A.tman's own natural,*
> >> *supreme state.]*
> >>
> >> Since the realization 'I am all', sarvoham' arises ONLY by the
> >> falsification of the objective world, mithyatva nishchaya', the above
> >> Mantra and Bhashya is the proof of the Jnani relizing even in dream that
> >> the world is mithya. We have to remember that falsification of world
> does
> >> not mean non-perception of the world. See the Panchadashi verses I
> posted
> >> in this thread.
> >>
> >> regards
> >> subbu
> >>
> >>>
> >>> or it is to be understood that..
> >>>
> >>> Jnani knows that dream is unreal and waking is unreal too (as all
> >>> avasthas
> >>> are due to adhyaasa), during waking only?
> >>>
> >>> Thanks
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
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-- 
Regards

-Venkatesh