[Advaita-l] Perception in lightning

[H S Chandramouli]

This only clarifies that no epistemological changes are called for while
accounting for observable scientific phenomena

Regards

Chandramouli

<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail>
Virus-free.
www.avast.com
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail>
<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 3:16 PM H S Chandramouli <hschandramouli at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Namaste.
>
> The current position is that vishaya for the sense organs are rUpa and
> shabda only. For ease of understanding perhaps,  they are referred to in
> texts like VP as objects. Hence no change is required. That is what I
> meant. Only proper understanding is needed.
>
> Regards
>
> Chandramouli
>
>
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail> Virus-free.
> www.avast.com
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail>
> <#m_5665423483376934482_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
> On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 3:05 PM Venkatraghavan S <agnimile at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Namaste
>> It is not to account for exceptions per se. The idea is to preserve as
>> much of the advaita epistemological framework as possible, while accounting
>> for observable scientific phenomena.
>>
>> That being the case, what was suggested is that if we change the concept
>> of what constitutes a viShaya to the subject (the object is not the
>> viShaya, light / sound is), one can preserve the existing framework while
>> addressing the challenge of viewing objects that have ceased to exist.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Venkatraghavan
>>
>> On Tue, 11 May 2021, 09:47 H S Chandramouli, <hschandramouli at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Namaste.
>>>
>>> Reg  << Thus all the terms related to viShayAvacChinna chaitanya can be
>>> recast to mean prabhAvacChinna chaitanya / shabdAvacChinna chaitanya etc
>>> >>,
>>>
>>> There is perhaps no need to recast anything. The present rendering
>>> covers practically all the commonly  met with experiences. We are perhaps
>>> considering exceptions. Hence a general reference to what has been
>>> clarified would  be enough to cover such exceptions
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>> Chandramouli.
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail> Virus-free.
>>> www.avast.com
>>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail>
>>> <#m_5665423483376934482_m_-2873140088161445427_m_-7682390552209184207_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>>>
>>> On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 1:22 PM Venkatraghavan S <agnimile at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Namaste
>>>> I was going to suggest this well. The object that is perceived is not
>>>> the physical object itself but light / sound emanating from it.
>>>>
>>>> Thus without needing the postulation of the mind to move towards a
>>>> physical object elsewhere, one could postulate that the light / sound
>>>> itself is the viShaya. Thus all the terms related to viShayAvacChinna
>>>> chaitanya can be recast to mean prabhAvacChinna chaitanya / shabdAvacChinna
>>>> chaitanya etc.
>>>>
>>>> Thus, the viShaya adhiShThAna chaitanya can still be the prakAshaka,
>>>> there is difference between paroksha and pratyaksha on account of the
>>>> prabhA / shabda making contact with the eyes, there is possible for bhrama
>>>> because of ajnAna in the viShaya (light/sound) avacChinna chaitanya.
>>>>
>>>> And as Sri Chandramouli says, this aligns with the anubhava of not
>>>> experiencing the exact quantum of distance in the perception of sound and
>>>> light even when one knows in general that it is far / near.
>>>>
>>>> That is simpler I feel and requires less items to postulate such as the
>>>> mind being able to travel back in time to see distant galaxies etc. While
>>>> it may be true for yogis, to say that everyone does that naturally does not
>>>> sit well.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Venkatraghavan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, 11 May 2021, 08:17 H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l, <
>>>> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Namaste.
>>>>>
>>>>> The following could perhaps form the basis for a resolution of the
>>>>> issue.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is cognized through vision is the rUpa (color) of the Vishaya. It
>>>>> could be considered as the light enveloping the object or emanating
>>>>> from it
>>>>> (in the case of lightning for example) as the case may be. While ‘being
>>>>>  distant’ is also perceived in the cognition, the actual location is
>>>>> not
>>>>> when the distance is large. Same with shabda or sound. While the sound
>>>>> is
>>>>> cognized as well as it being ‘distant’, exact distance is not involved
>>>>> in
>>>>> the cognition.
>>>>>
>>>>> We can now consider ‘where’  the cognition takes place when all the
>>>>> three
>>>>> involved in the cognition; namely antahkarana vritti,rUpa or light
>>>>> enveloping/emnating from the object, and shabda or sound emanating
>>>>> from the
>>>>> object;  all three are in motion, and the distances between the
>>>>> objects and
>>>>> the experience are large.The location where visual cognition takes
>>>>> place
>>>>> can be considered as the location where the rUpa or light enveloping
>>>>> the
>>>>> object or emanating from it is coincident with the antahkarana vritti
>>>>> issuing forth through the eyes. Similarly for the cognition of sound.
>>>>> These
>>>>> locations need not be the same as their origin. When distances
>>>>> involved are
>>>>> negligible compared to their speeds, location of cognition will be
>>>>> practically the same as the object. When distances are large, they
>>>>> could be
>>>>> quite different.
>>>>>
>>>>> This explains the reason for cognition taking place at different times
>>>>> in
>>>>> case of lightning and thunder for example. This would also cover
>>>>> anomalies
>>>>> in respect of cognition of very distant stars/planets etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> Chandramouli
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>>>
>>>>> <
>>>>> https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail
>>>>> >
>>>>> Virus-free.
>>>>> www.avast.com
>>>>> <
>>>>> https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail
>>>>> >
>>>>> <#m_-4332257227125025052_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Archives: https://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/archives/advaita-l/
>>>>> http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.culture.religion.advaita
>>>>>
>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your options:
>>>>> https://lists.advaita-vedanta.org/cgi-bin/listinfo/advaita-l
>>>>>
>>>>> For assistance, contact:
>>>>> listmaster at advaita-vedanta.org
>>>>>
>>>>