[Advaita-l] ***UNCHECKED*** Re: [advaitin] Re: Analysis of Standpoints

[H S Chandramouli]

Namaskaram.

There is no vyAvahArika or pAramArthika viewpoint  of a jnAni in my
understanding. The nature of a jnAni is as follows in my understanding.

For an ajnAni, the *I* sense identifies itself very strongly with the
antahkaraNa or BMI. I am not elaborating as it is unnecessary. For a jnAni,
there are two states possible. In one state, his *I* sense completely
dissociates itself from the antahkaraNa or BMI and *identifies*  itself
 with Brahman. This is his state of nirvikalpa samAdhi. There is no
perception of duality. But there is really no *experiential anubhava*
 either in such a state. At other times, the *I* sense of the jnAni
identifies itself with the antahkaraNa or BMI, but such identification is
very very weak. He perceives duality no doubt, but with very little
association with the duality. His understanding is one of  sarvAtmabhAva
and he enjoys great Ananda in this state. Experiences of Sages
Vamadeva/Trishnku /Sthitaprajna  etc  fall in this category. This is the
experiential jnAna phala of a jnAni. He can and does interact with the
world in such a state, and is perhaps what you have termed vyAvahArika
standpoint. Since the identification with BMI is very weak, there is no
resultant karma phala associated with any of his actions. Hence there is no
rebirth for him.

This in brief is my understanding.
Regards

On Tue, Dec 13, 2022 at 3:15 PM putran M <putranm4 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Namaskaram,
>
>
>> to insist on as the only standpoint that constitutes truth. The
>> "traditional" side (as I understand) accepts the paramarthika standpoint
>> but does not negate absolutely (as being *only* adhyasa) the vyavaharika
>> standpoint.
>>
>>
> Analogy for two-standpoint perspective: Consider "stone". There is a
> paramarthika standpoint where there is only Stone and naught else. (This
> should not be confused as "Duality exists but is not cognized or lost in
> some other higher Cognition". Duality is simply asat in paramarthika).
> There is a vyavaharika standpoint where the statue nama-rupa appearance is
> posited in the stone and (for the jnani) the adhishtana stone is manifest
> as Statue. The ajnani starts talking of the hands and eyes as distinct
> realities; the jnani sees only stone appearing as All. The statue-cognition
> for both jnani and ajnani is not simply due to adhyasa that has to vanish
> upon realizing I am seeing Stone only. It denotes a lower order of reality.
>
> thollmelukaalkizhu
>
>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> thollmelukaalkizhu
>>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 13, 2022 at 2:17 AM H S Chandramouli <
>>> hschandramouli at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Namaste.
>>>>
>>>> Reg  << The issue as I understand is whether a duality of cognition can
>>>> be admitted in spite of and alongside the knowledge of nondual Self >>,
>>>>
>>>> Shruti is the authority in this regard and it has adequately addressed
>>>>  the issue. It lists the experiences of Sages Vamadeva, Trishanku (in TU),
>>>> the jnAni who exclaims **ahamanna….ahamannAdah…** in TU etc  which address
>>>> the issue unambiguously. Such a duality of cognition is admitted. Where
>>>>  then is the doubt?
>>>> Regards
>>>>
>>>> On Monday, December 12, 2022 at 12:24:27 PM UTC+5:30 putranm4 wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The swamiji explains their viewpoint on adhyasa between minutes 10 and
>>>>> 15.
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfB6BmYrBqU&list=PLMddRSWoHnQY9kX3hpmMgw2WZg0b0fJ82
>>>>>
>>>>> One cannot unambiguously tell whether he thinks these statements
>>>>> contradict the traditionalist's position.
>>>>>
>>>>> We all agree that adhyasa does not exist for the atma ("from His
>>>>> standpoint"), and vanishes when awareness turns towards it (or aligns with
>>>>> paramarthika standpoint). We agree that for the knower, the Self alone is
>>>>> the adhishtana of all cognition. The issue as I understand is whether a
>>>>> duality of cognition can be admitted in spite of and alongside the
>>>>> knowledge of nondual Self, and the implications thereafter: Like, Two
>>>>> standpoints: 1. Brahman 2. Brahman+Maya; Maya (and nama-rupa) mithya,
>>>>> Brahman sathya. etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> thollmelukaalkizhu
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 9:59 PM putran M <putr... at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Namaskaram,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> “ so long as he [jnani] sees the duality”
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here, it should be obvious that the duality mentioned as being seen
>>>>>> by the jnani is of the movie-appearance category ( affirming cognition of
>>>>>> nama-rupa multiplicity), sans the (ignorance) belief in its contents that
>>>>>> the ajnani has. According to this strict viewpoint, even such a rudimentary
>>>>>> acknowledgment of nama-rupa (seer-seen divide) *dualistic*
>>>>>> appearance belongs to vyavaharika and corresponds to *dualistic*
>>>>>> association of Maya in Brahman. The negation of such vyavaharika is not
>>>>>> done by calling it adhyasa on paramarthika; rather it belongs to a lower
>>>>>> level of ‘reality’ that is mithya from the standpoint of the Jnani in
>>>>>> vyavaharika.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thollmelukaalkizhu
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Dec 12, 2022 at 12:44 AM putran M <putr... at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Namaskaram,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Compiled some thoughts. Attaching as a file.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> thollmelukaalkizhu
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>
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