[Advaita-l] ***UNCHECKED*** Re: [advaitin] Bhavarupa and Orders of Reality

[H S Chandramouli]

Namaste Sudhanshu Ji,

Reg  <<  In sansarga-adhyAsa, can it not happen between objects of
different order
of reality? >>,

Yes. That is correct. It can and does indeed. Thanks for pointing out the
error. Statement in my earlier post

<<  In संसर्गाध्यास (saMsargAdhyAsa)  on the other hand, the entities are
considered as of the same Order of Reality, but their relationship or
association   is  of a different Order of Reality and considered as अध्यास
(adhyAsa). Their relationship  or association  can neither be declared
related or nonrelated  अनिर्वचनीय (anirvachanIya). Examples are mirror and
reflection there in, clear crystal and  its coloration due to a nearby
flower. In this case, mirror/reflection as well as crystal/coloration are
of one Order  of Reality,  while their relationship or association is
another Order of Reality. >>

Should have read

<<  In संसर्गाध्यास (saMsargAdhyAsa)  on the other hand, the entities are
considered as established in their respective nature, but their
 relationship or association or identification can neither be declared
related or nonrelated  अनिर्वचनीय (anirvachanIya). Examples are mirror and
reflection there in, clear crystal and  its coloration due to a nearby
flower. In this case, mirror/reflection as well as crystal/coloration are
of one Order  of Reality,  while their relationship or association is
another Order of Reality  >>.

AdhyAsa between Atman and anAtman is characterized as संसर्गाध्यास
(saMsargAdhyAsa) and not स्वरूपाध्यास (svarUpAdhyAsa).

I may add here that there is a whole lot of different types of adhyAsA
 listed in addition to what I have mentioned above. A very comprehensive
review  of these is available in the commentary in hindi on the text विज्ञान
नौक (vij~nAna nauka) of Sri Bhagavatpada by Bhagavan Pandit Sadhuvarya
which is translated in kannada by Sri Mysore Shivananda Subrahmanya Shastri
. The topic of adhyAsa is  very well presented. Link for the same

<<  https://www.scribd.com/document/485906961/Vijnananauka-of-Shankaracharya
>>

I could not locate the link to the hindi version.

Regards
Chandramouli



On Sat, Dec 24, 2022 at 3:15 PM Sudhanshu Shekhar via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Hari Om Chandramouli ji.
>
> In sansarga-adhyAsa, can it not happen between objects of different order
> of reality? Brahman and world, there is sansarga-adhyAsa. Idam and Rajat,
> there is sansarga-adhyAsa.
>
> How do you state that sansarga-adhyAsa is between objects having same order
> of reality.
>
> Regards.
>
> On Sat, 24 Dec, 2022, 2:12 pm H S Chandramouli via Advaita-l, <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> > Namaste.
> >
> > Reg  <<  It is said that avidya is bhavarupa i.e. something that is
> > existentent because otherwise jnana cannot remove it. My question is - by
> > existence what is meant - conceptual existence or physical existence? >>,
> >
> >  avidyA as bhAvarUpa involves both *conceptual* meaning jnAna , as well
> as
> > *physical* meaning *vastu* or *object*. Technically it is termed
> involving
> > both अर्थाध्यास (arthAdhyAsa)  and ज्ञानाध्यास (j~nAnAdhyAsa).
> >
> > Conceptual  alone would mean something relating to jnAna ONLY. Nothing
> >  *physical* associated with it. That makes avidyA  *abhAvarUpa*. Only
> > ज्ञानाध्यास (j~nAnAdhyAsa), but no अर्थाध्यास (arthAdhyAsa).
> >
> > Reg  << The second question on which I am seeking clarity is on orders of
> > reality. It seems to me that whenever there is adhyasa, the substratum
> and
> > the superimposition belong to two different orders of reality. If this is
> > not so, subsequent sublation is impossible  >>,
> >
> > AdhyAsa always involves different Orders of Reality. There are  different
> >  types of AdhyAsa. They are categorized also in different ways.
> >
> > One way of categorization is  स्वरूपाध्यास (svarUpAdhyAsa) and
> संसर्गाध्यास
> > (saMsargAdhyAsa).
> >
> > In स्वरूपाध्यास (svarUpAdhyAsa) the entities involved are themselves
> > considered to be of  different Orders of Reality. Superimposition of
> > Rope-Snake on Rope,Creation on Brahman are examples of  स्वरूपाध्यास
> > (svarUpAdhyAsa). Rope-Snake and  Creation belong to different Orders of
> > Reality  with respect to Rope and Brahman respectively, and are
> considered
> >  अध्यास  by their  very nature (स्वरूप  svarUpa).
> >
> > In संसर्गाध्यास (saMsargAdhyAsa)  on the other hand, the entities are
> > considered as of the same Order of Reality, but their relationship or
> > association   is  of a different Order of Reality and considered as
> अध्यास
> > (adhyAsa). Their relationship  or association  can neither be declared
> >  related or nonrelated  अनिर्वचनीय (anirvachanIya). Examples are mirror
> and
> > reflection there in, clear crystal and  its coloration due to a nearby
> > flower. In this case, mirror/reflection as well as crystal/coloration are
> > of one Order  of Reality,  while their relationship or association is
> > another Order of Reality.
> >
> > Another way of categorization is निरुपाधिक अध्यास (nirupAdhika adhyAsa)
> and
> > सोपाधिक अध्यास (sopAdhika adhyAsa).  They could be considered as broadly
> > corresponding to  स्वरूपाध्यास (svarUpAdhyAsa) and संसर्गाध्यास
> > (saMsargAdhyAsa) respectively.
> >
> > My understanding.
> >
> > Regards
> > Chandramouli
> >
> > On Sat, Dec 24, 2022 at 12:32 AM S Venkatraman <svenkat52 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Namaste,
> > >
> > > From all the discussions going on in this forum, I am quite confused
> > about
> > > the meaning of the term bhavarupa and hence am seeking clarity.
> > >
> > > It is said that avidya is bhavarupa i.e. something that is existentent
> > > because otherwise jnana cannot remove it. My question is - by existence
> > > what is meant - conceptual existence or physical existence?
> > >
> > > The second question on which I am seeking clarity is on orders of
> > reality.
> > > It seems to me that whenever there is adhyasa, the substratum and the
> > > superimposition belong to two different orders of reality. If this is
> not
> > > so, subsequent sublation is impossible.
> > >
> > > Example 1 - World is superimposed on Brahman due to avidya. World
> belongs
> > > to Vyaavahaarika satta and Brahman to Paaramaarthika satta.
> > >
> > > Example 2 - Snake is superimposed on Rope due to bad light. Snake
> belongs
> > > to Praatibhaasika satta and rope to Vyaavahaarika satta.
> > >
> > > Is my understanding right?
> > >
> > > Thank you and regards,
> > > Venkat
> > >
> > > Sent from my iPhone
> > >
> > > On 23-Dec-2022, at 10:30 PM, Jaishankar Narayanan <jai1971 at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > Namaste,
> > >
> > > According to Bhaskar ji avidyA-kalpita (atyanta asat
> > jnAna-abhAva-kalpita)
> > > mAyA is vyAvahArika satya and it is ‘existing thing’ like water!! and
> it
> > > is anirvachaneeya.
> > >
> > > Really great logic!
> > >
> > > with love and prayers,
> > > Jaishankar
> > >
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