[Advaita-l] [advaitin] rAma-krishna-shiva-durga etc. are not same in shAstric vyavahAra!!!

[Venkatraghavan S]

Namaste Bhaskar ji,

On Mon, Feb 6, 2023 at 11:45 AM 'Bhaskar YR' via advaitin <
advaitin at googlegroups.com> wrote:

> praNAms Sri Venkataraghavan prabhuji
>
> Hare Krishna
>
>
>
> Thank you. Yes there is tAratamyatA among the deva-s - ie agni, indra, all
> the way up to hiraNyagarbha - because they are all ultimately jIva-s.
>
>
>
> Ø     Ultimately jeeva-s!!??  kindly elaborate.  The Rigveda mantra ekaM
> sat viprA bahudA vadanti continues to say that : agni, yamaM
> mAtarishwAnamAhuH, those who have been addressed as : indra, mitra, varuNa,
> agni etc. behind all these there is only one reality.  So, I think your
> statement :  *ultimately* jeeva-s needs bit elaboration.
>
That these devatA-s are all jIva-s are known from several places from the
shruti and the bhAShya  - hiraNyagarbha is called prathamajah (first born)
in many places. The ekam sat viprA bahudhA vadanti calls these devatA-s as
sat, not in their devatAsvarUpa, but in their kAraNa svarUpa as Brahman. So
SAyaNAchArya in his bhAShya for this rig mantra says : कथं एकस्य
नानात्वमुच्यते - अमुमेवादित्यम् एकं एव वस्तुतः सन्तं विप्राः मेधाविनः
देवतातत्त्वविदः बहुधा वदन्ति | तत्तत्कार्यकारणेन इन्द्राद्यात्मानं वदन्ति
...सूर्यस्य ब्रह्मणोऽनन्यत्वेन सार्वात्म्यमुक्तं भवति |

So indra etc are not Ishvara as indra, but in the kAraNa svarUpa of indrAdi
devatA-s. As indrAdi they are jIva-s only.


>  However there is no tAratamyatA among various forms of Ishvara. The devI
> being worshipped during navarAtrI is equal to Shiva being worshipped during
> shivarAtri who is equal to the Rama being worshipped during rAmanavamI -
> both are forms of Ishvara only, but a particular name and form of the
> Ishvara is being worshipped there, for ease of worship.
>
>
>
> Ø     The upasiddhAnta that I can draw from this is ( I may be wrong
> here) Ishwara’s form or vyAkruta rUpa is restricted to some specified
> celebrities in celestial abode like devi, rAma, Krishna, shiva etc. but not
> IndrAdi devata.  If that is the case this difference between indrAdi devata
> (ultimately jeeva-s) and other main deva-devata  not something related to
> upAdhi but something else!!??  Or am I missing something here??  Please
> clarify.
>

It is definitely possible to worship indrAdi devatAs in their kAraNa
svarUpa as Ishvara (where the shruti enjoins so), and in doing that, such
an upAsana is not indra upAsana - it is Ishvara upAsana only. That is why
when we are worshipping devI, rAma, Krishna, shiva, while we are
worshipping the names and forms, we are not worshipping them as names and
forms, but as names and forms *of *Ishvara.

The shAstra is giving us these names and forms as "tools" to be able to
conceptualise that which is beyond conceptualisation. Which form of Ishvara
is to be worshipped and how that form is to be worshipped is not something
that we can take up independently - it has to be something that is enjoined
in the shAstra-s. There will be differences in the manner of worship for
each name and form - because the shAstra-s gives us those differences.

So the siddhAnta is *not* that only some forms *are* Ishvara and others are
not (because Ishvara is sarvAtmakah), but rather, *what* the shAstra says
that one should accept as a form of Ishvara fit to be worshipped, is to be
worshipped *as* Ishvara, not *as a name and form*.


Regards,
Venkatraghavan