[Advaita-l] The fate of mind after realization

[Michael Chandra Cohen]

Aum and Namaste,
Here are some citations that hopefully inform the conversation.
First, as to the  absolute nondual necessity of JnAna;
Second, as to the dependence of knower, knowing and known upon avidyA.

*NONDUALITY  Citations*

·         “But when in dreamless sleep that nescience which sets up the
appearance of beings other than the Self has ceased, there is no (apparent)
entity separated from oneself as another. Then with what could one see,
smell or understand what? The One is embraced by one’s own Self as
intelligence (prajna), of the nature of self-luminous light. One is then
all serene, with one’s desires attained, transparent as water, and all one
on account of the absence of any second. For, if a second thing is
distinguished, it is distinguished through nescience, and as that has now
ceased, what is left is all one.

//… In the same way, my dear one, because they had no knowledge when they
mingled with pure Being, all these creatures likewise, the tiger and so
forth, have no knowledge of the fact when they have returned from pure
Being. They are not aware, ‘I have returned from pure Being’. Chand. Bh.
6.9.1”

·         In the same way, one who was ignorant of the Self and who is
awakened from this ignorance by the Vedic text (sruti) sees nothing other
than his own Self. The Teacher (guru), the texts and he himself as deluded
individual soul have all disappeared. (Nais Siddhi 4.37)

·         'There is no plurality here' (Brhad. 4.4.19)

·         'He goes from death to death who sees the appearance of plurality
here' (Brhad 4.4.19)

·         'When, however, this soul makes in this one the smallest interval
(difference), then, for him, there is fear' (Taitt. 2.7),

·         'Assuredly it is from a second (thing) that fear arises' (Brhad.
1.4.2)

·         'But there is no second thing' (Brhad. 4.3.24)

·         'For where there is an appearance of duality ... (but when all
has become his own Self, then what could a person see, and with what?)'
(Brhad. 2.4.14).
·         “How can distinction and non-distinction which are contrary to
each other be both possible? (We reply)—this is no fault, because we have
already established in several proper places, that according to the maxim
of “The Akasha and the Akasha of the pot”, both are possible. Besides when
the non-distinction (between the two) comes to be realized, by means of
such reference to non-distinction, as “That thou art”, then the nature of
the transmigratory existence of the Jiva-Self, and the creative activity of
Brahma, both vanish, on account of the removal of the entire set of
transactions, depending upon the notion of distinction which is but only a
display of false-ignorance, by true knowledge. BSbh II. i. 23]

·         It is like this. As a man embraced by a woman he loves is
oblivious to everything within or without, so this person embraced by the
self (Atman) consisting of knowledge is oblivious to everything within or
without (BU 4.3.21)

·         "That it ·does not' see in that ·state is because, although
seeing then It does not see; for the vision of the witness can never be
lost, because it is immortal. But there is not that second thing separate
from it which it can see. BrU4.3.23

·         The infinite is that where one does not see anything else, does
not hear anything else, and does not understand anything else (CU 7.24.1)

·         When, however, the Whole has become one’s very self (tman), then
who is there for one to smell and by what means? Who is there for one to
see and by what means? Who is there for one to hear and by what means? Who
is there for one to see and by what means? Who is there for one to hear and
by what means? Who is there for one to greet and by what means? Who is
there for one to think and by what means. Who is there for one to perceive
and by what means? (BU 2.4.14 & BU 4.5.15.)


Eight Upanishads With Sankarabhashyam Swami Gambhirananda Vol 1 1966

*NO PRAMATA, PRAMANA, PRAMEYA*

·         “In the recognition that there is no second thing, duality
resolves” – jnate dvaitam no vidyate GK 1.18

·         Nanu: The pramanas must be invalid since they since they give
knowledge about objects that are unreal. Thus instruction itself loses its
point in that it cannot lead to truth or liberation.
Sankara’s reply: yes, it is quite true the pramanas are no less mithya than
are the objects they propose to reveal however they may “produce” something
real no less than death from a fancied snakebite. But, it is further
argued, death is as unreal as its cause and we are looking for a real
effect out of an unreal cause.  BS bh 2.1.14

·         "That it ·does not' see in that ·state is because, although
seeing then It does not see; for the vision of the witness can never be
lost, because it is immortal. But there is not that second thing separate
from it which it can see. BrU4.3.23

·         This mutual superimposition of the non-Self and the Self
(*atmānatmanor
itaretara adhyāsaṁ*) that is called avidya (*avidya akhyam*) is the basis (
*puraskṛtya*) on which rest all the practical distinctions between means of
knowledge and objects of knowledge (*sarve pramāṇa prameya*)….
 Samadhana: This is being explained. (a)When there is no possibility of one
who is devoid of identification with ‘I’ and ‘mine’ with regard to the body
and sense organs, to become a cognizer, the means of knowledge is
inoperative for without (the participation of) the sense organs the means
of knowledge such as perception cannot operate. (b)The function of the
sense organs is not possible without a basis (body). (c)Nor does one become
engaged in activity without attributing the notion ‘I’ to the body. When
all these do not combine the Self that is unattached cannot become a
cognizer, there is no operation of the means of knowledge. Therefore, the
means of knowledge such as perception and the scriptures are meant only for
those that remain on the plane of avidya. (adhyasa bhasya)

·         It is like this. As a man embraced by a woman he loves is
oblivious to everything within or without, so this person embraced by the
self (Atman) consisting of knowledge is oblivious to everything within or
without (BU 4.3.21)

·         "That it ·does not' see in that ·state is because, although
seeing then It does not see; for the vision of the witness can never be
lost, because it is immortal. But there is not that second thing separate
from it which it can see. BrU4.3.23

·        “'0 good looking one, in the beginning this was Existence alone,
One only, without a second.” ChU 6.2.1

·        Bhasya: “Vediintin: No. Since the instruction of oneness is given
by saying 'Thou art That', there is no scope for the difference between the
basis and the thing supported, and similarly, there can be no scope of any
vision with regard to oneself, since it has been ascertained in the sixth
chapter that Truth is one Existence, without a second; and also in
Upani~adic texts like: , ... established in this unperceivable, bodiless
... Brahman' (Tai. II.7.1); 'His form does not exist within the range of
vision' (Ka.11.3.9); 'Through what, 0 Maitreyi, should one know the
knower?' (Br. 11.4.14). … The idea is that this (finitude) exists during
the period of ignorance. It is like a thing seen in a dream, which exists
only during that period, before waking.”

·        “He goes from death to death who sees any difference here.” KaU
2.1.10

·        And this name and form are merely imagined in the Absolute, like
day and night in the sun. From the standpoint of the highest truth, they do
not exist.”Tait Bh 2.8

·        Neither from itself nor from something else is anything born.
Neither an existent nor a non-existent … is born. GK 4.22

·        “Through the mind alone (It) is to be realised. There is no
difference whatsoever in It. He goes from death to death, who sees
difference, as it were, in It.” Br 4.4.19

·        This duality existing of the knower and the knowable is only the
vibration of the citta. …GK4.72

·        … But there is no duality there GK4.75

·        Because the Imperishable is unmanifest, He is not accessible to
words and cannot therefore be defined. He is unmanifest, not manifest to
any of the organs of knowledge.” (BGbh 12 3)

·        It is known to him to whom It is unknown; he does not know to whom
it is known. It is unknown to those who know well, and known to those who
do not know. Ke 2.3.

·        But in a context where the unconditioned Self is one, there can
neither be knowing by oneself not by another. Kebh2.4

·        "For when there is duality, as it were, then one… knows another.
But when everything has become the Self, then what should one …know and
through what? "Br2.4.14

On Mon, Jan 23, 2023 at 8:22 AM Sudhanshu Shekhar via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Hari Om Bhaskar ji.
>
> Clay-pot and water-wave examples correspond to material causality. That is
> superimposed in Brahman through ajnAna. The material causality of ajnAna
> vis-a-vis-world is superimposed in Brahman.
>
> The non-difference of world with Brahman in the view of jnAnI is similar to
> non-difference of mirage-water with desert. One sees the mirage-water,
> understands it to be desert appearing illusorily as water and does not go
> there to quench one's thirst. JnAnI sees the world, understands it to be
> Brahman appearing illusorily as world and is unaffected.
>
> Clay-pot or water-wave indicate causality to Brahman whereas mirage-water
> depicts the ultimate.
>
> तदिति सर्वनाम, सर्वं च ब्रह्म, तस्य नाम तदिति, तद्भावः तत्त्वम् ,
> ब्रह्मणो याथात्म्यम् । तत् द्रष्टुं शीलं येषां ते तत्त्वदर्शिनः, तैः
> तत्त्वदर्शिभिः ।
>
>  त्वमपि तत्त्वदर्शिनां दृष्टिमाश्रित्य शोकं मोहं च हित्वा शीतोष्णादीनि
> नियतानियतरूपाणि द्वन्द्वानि ‘विकारोऽयमसन्नेव मरीचिजलवन्मिथ्यावभासते’
> इति मनसि निश्चित्य तितिक्षस्व इत्यभिप्रायः ॥
> १६ ॥
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