[Advaita-l] [advaitin] SSSS on the controversy between mulav7idya and abhavarupa - directly and simply explained as per SSSS

[Raghav Kumar Dwivedula]

Namaste Jaishankar ji

On Sat, 24 Aug, 2024, 9:18 am Jaishankar Narayanan via Advaita-l, <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Namaste Raghav ji,
>
> Yes. Sureshvara by saying amitra has unambiguously said that avidya is
> vidya-virodhi. Also by saying anatma is avidya he has said it is upAdAna
> like saying pot is clay.
>
> SSS followers should be honest and propose their prakriya as an independent
> prakriya like so many modern Yoga-Vedantins do and not torture the words of
> Shankara and Sureshvara to gain legitimacy.
>
> I think they are almost there since it was said that Sri SSS's words are
*prAmANika* while tarka maybe clever but is subject to future revision or
contradiction. Whenever tarka contradicts Sri SSS, it is shuShka.

In other words, if there is a certain idea/passage in bhAShya which leaves
some room for multiple interpretations. And if Sri SSS proposes a certain
way, while tarka/yukti/logic clearly suggests another, we have to reject
logic and accept Sri SSS.(Like in the Eskimo-nyAya case).  Because tarka is
subject to future contradiction while Sri SSS is infallible.

It's a compelling case and the shraddhA is praiseworthy.

When rock meet scissors, scissors loses. Period.

Om
Raghav


> We may need to assert that the word amitra has virodhArthe na~n  upasarga
> > (amitra = enemy) rather than abhAvArthe na~n (amitra = friendless).
> >
> > Om
> >
> > On Sat, 24 Aug, 2024, 6:55 am Jaishankar Narayanan via Advaita-l, <
> > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> >
> > > Namaste,
> > >
> > > Looking at the below message from Bhaskar ji now, I want to know how he
> > or
> > > SSS interprets the following TUBV verses from Brahmavalli
> > >
> > > परात्मनोऽप्यनन्तस्य क्षेत्रज्ञत्वमविद्यया ।
> > > क्षेत्रज्ञं चापि मां विद्धीत्येवं सत्युपपद्यते ॥ १७५ ॥
> > >
> > > न जानामीत्यविद्यैकाऽनित्या तत्कारणं मता ।
> > > स्वप्रसिद्ध्यैव सा सिध्येन्निशौलूकीव वासरे ॥ १७६ ॥
> > >
> > > प्रमाणोत्पन्नया दृष्ट्या योऽविद्यां द्रष्टुमिच्चति ।
> > > दीपेनासौ ध्रुवं पश्येद् गुहाकुक्षिगतं तमः ॥ १७७ ॥
> > >
> > > अनात्मेतीह यद्भाति तदविद्याविजृम्भितम् ।
> > > तस्मादविद्या साऽप्युक्ता विद्या त्वात्मैकरूपिणी ॥ १७८ ॥
> > >
> > > आत्माग्रहातिरेकेण तस्या रूपं न विद्यते ।
> > > अमित्रवदविद्येति सत्येवं घटते सदा ॥ १७९ ॥
> > >
> > > Paramatma becomes kshetrajna due to avidya. Avidya is sakshi bhaAsya in
> > the
> > > form of 'I do not know' like even the Owl sees the darkness of night as
> > > daytime. Avidya cannot be known through pramana as it is like trying to
> > see
> > > darkness with the help of a lamp. All anAtma is a projection of avidyA,
> > so
> > > it is called avidyA  and vidyA is only in the form of self conscious
> > Atma.
> > > It does not exist in any other form other than non apprehension of
> Atma -
> > > it is only tenable if it is said that avidyA is like the term amitra
> (not
> > > friend - which cannot be an abhAva)
> > >
> > > There cannot be a clearer evidence than the above to prove that
> > Sureshvara
> > > and all other Sampradaya Acharyas were talking about avidyA in the same
> > > way. SSS followers should not ostracize Sureshvara too :-)
> > >
> > > Namaste,
> > > Jaishankar
> > >
> > > On Wed, Aug 21, 2024 at 12:02 PM 'Bhaskar YR' via advaitin <
> > > advaitin at googlegroups.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > praNAms
> > > >
> > > > Hare Krishna
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Sri SSS’s take on vArtikakAra is very simple and straightforward.  He
> > > > observes in one of his works : the vArtikakAra has NOT accepted
> > mUlAvidyA
> > > > as advocated by the vivaraNakAra.  As per vArtika prakriya barring
> the
> > > > three aspects of ajnAna for jnAna there is no other obstacle
> > whatsoever.
> > > > AjnAna or jnAnAbhAva itself is the essence of the other two variants
> > i.e.
> > > > misconception and doubt.  So any number of vArtika quotes would
> simply
> > > > cannot go against this final stand on avidyA by vArtikakAra.  Sri
> > Vittala
> > > > shastri talks about these vArtika references and clarifies that these
> > > > quotes would not help us to prove ‘fourth’ type of avidyA which is
> > > > conspicuous by its absence in Tai. & bru vArtika and NS.  He further
> > > > clarified that there is no profound and pronounced differences in
> > > vArtika-s
> > > > when compared to mUla bhAshya. vArtikakAra not only followed mUla
> > bhAshya
> > > > religiously but also added some yukti-s (logical devices) of
> > bhAshyakAra
> > > to
> > > > further strengthening them.  There are some place there is a talk
> about
> > > > upAdAnatva of avidyA etc. but it is not the subject matter of proving
> > > > avidyA upAdAna kAranatva in that particular context, and here too
> > avidyA
> > > is
> > > > jnAnAbhAva only that leads to adhyAsa.  So, Sri SSS’s followers may
> > > please
> > > > be assured that unlike vyAkhyAna, vArtika followed mUla and
> elaborated
> > > > whatever in mUla without introducing some extra alien concepts like
> > > > bhAvarUpa, jadAtmaka, anirvachaneeya brahmAshrita, sadasatvilakshaNa
> > > > mUlAvidyA.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!
> > > >
> > > > bhaskar
> > > >
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