[Advaita-l] While jiva is avidya-kruta adhyaropa, Ishwara is shaastra-kruta adhyaropa

[V Subrahmanian]

Very well summarized, Raghav Ji, thanks.

warm regards,
subbu

On Mon, Dec 2, 2024 at 4:36 PM Raghav Kumar Dwivedula via Advaita-l <
advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:

> Namaste Subbu ji
> It's clear that only someone who has taken formal sannyasa ie the monastic
> lifestyle with no pursuit of a wealth etc., is eligible for the exclusive
> pursuit of jnAna yoga.
>
> For a person engaged in jnAna yoga as pursuit (ie shravaNam, mananaM and
> even nididhyAsanam llfor that matter) bhakti and upasana of Ishvara
> continues and there is no conflict at all in doing japaM etc and vedAnta
> sadhanas. There is no injunction to cease japaM etc upon making some
> headway in vedAnta. Only kartRtva-mithyAtvaM is to be understood and
> embodied in one's life.
>
> Even for a vividiShA sannyAsI, bhakti for Ishvara and karmas like seva of
> the guru continue.
>
> It's only the pursuit of celibacy,  renunciation of wealth-seeking pursuits
> and rituals for specific kAmya phalas that are meant when we talk of
> "renunciation of karmas."
>
> I do sometimes notice a funny trend of students of vedAnta drop all nitya
> karmas and even japaM in a misplaced zeal for "renunciation of karma".
>
> The conduct and attitude of Sri Shankara bhagavatpada and the later
> Shankaracharyas is a resounding endorsement of Ishvara bhakti (upAdana,
> japa etc) as being wholly complementary and facilitative for the pursuit of
> Self-knowledge by Vedanta sadhanam.
>
>
> Om
>
> Raghav
>
>
> Om
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, 2 Dec, 2024, 1:40 pm V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l, <
> advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, Dec 2, 2024 at 1:17 PM Krishna Kashyap <kkashyap2011 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > namaste Subrahmanian Ji,
> > > thanks for the timely email. We were discussing this same issue in my
> > > class on Kena Upanishad (shankara bhashya) last week.
> > >
> > > Please explain some other issues that surfaced:
> > >
> > > 1) Karma yoga and bhakti are possible only
> > > towards Ishwara. If so, a person ready for jnana yoga must not do karma
> > > or bhakti yoga. Please give a clear view of what kind of person can
> give
> > up
> > > karma and bhakti yoga. Please provide some clear support using
> prasthana
> > > traya bhashya of Shankaracharya.
> > > phrasing this question with regards to any one of us: How will I know
> > that
> > > I am not fit to do any karma? I should focus only on Jnana yoga?
> > >
> >
> > Namaste
> >
> > The one ready for Jnana yoga, on the basis of the BG 6th chapter, would
> > have renounced karma.
> >
> > आरुरुक्षोर्मुनेर्योगं कर्म कारणमुच्यते ।
> > योगारूढस्य तस्यैव शमः कारणमुच्यते ॥ ३ ॥
> >
> > The Bhashyam gives clarification on questions that arise in us:
> >
> > आरुरुक्षोः आरोढुमिच्छतः, अनारूढस्य, ध्यानयोगे अवस्थातुमशक्तस्यैवेत्यर्थः
> ।
> > कस्य तस्य आरुरुक्षोः ? मुनेः, कर्मफलसंन्यासिन इत्यर्थः । किमारुरुक्षोः ?
> > योगम् । कर्म कारणं साधनम् उच्यते । योगारूढस्य पुनः तस्यैव शमः उपशमः
> > सर्वकर्मभ्यो निवृत्तिः कारणं योगारूढस्य साधनम् उच्यते इत्यर्थः ।
> यावद्यावत्
> > कर्मभ्यः उपरमते, तावत्तावत् निरायासस्य जितेन्द्रियस्य चित्तं समाधीयते ।
> तथा
> > सति स झटिति योगारूढो भवति । तथा चोक्तं व्यासेन — ‘नैतादृशं
> ब्राह्मणस्यास्ति
> > वित्तं यथैकता समता सत्यता च । शीलं स्थितिर्दण्डनिधानमार्जवं
> ततस्ततश्चोपरमः
> > क्रियाभ्यः’ (मो. ध. १७५ । ३७) इति ॥ ३ ॥
> >
> > For the one intending to ascend Jnana (dhyana nididhyanasanam), karma is
> > the path: produces chitta shuddhi/ekaagrataa.  For this very person who
> has
> > ascended to Yoga, karma, action, is not there.
> >
> > Bhakti is not to be given up.  Only that there will be more emphasis on
> > Nirguna Brahma bhakti that is dhyanam, upanishadic vichara.
> >
> > Ideally one is endowed with a Guru, marga darshaka.  He will advise the
> > aspirant on when he is to give up karma, when he is to engage in more
> > focused nirguna dhyana, vichara.
> >
> > Here also we get inputs from Shankara's Bh.gita 2.20 Bhashya on the above
> > topic:
> >
> >  स च अविद्वान् , ‘उभौ तौ न विजानीतः’ (भ. गी. २ । १९)
> > <
> >
> https://advaitasharada.sringeri.net/display/bhashya/Gita/devanagari?page=2&id=BG_C02_V19&hl=%E0%A4%89%E0%A4%AD%E0%A5%8C%20%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8C%20%E0%A4%A8%20%E0%A4%B5%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%9C%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A8%E0%A5%80%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%83
> > >
> > इति
> > वचनात् , विशेषितस्य च विदुषः कर्माक्षेपवचनाच्च ‘कथं स पुरुषः’ इति ।
> तस्मात्
> > विशेषितस्य अविक्रियात्मदर्शिनः विदुषः मुमुक्षोश्च सर्वकर्मसंन्यासे एव
> > अधिकारः । अत एव भगवान् नारायणः साङ्ख्यान् विदुषः अविदुषश्च कर्मिणः
> > प्रविभज्य द्वे निष्ठे ग्राहयति — ‘ज्ञानयोगेन साङ्‍ख्यानां कर्मयोगेन
> > योगिनाम्’ (भ. गी. ३ । ३)
> > <
> >
> https://advaitasharada.sringeri.net/display/bhashya/Gita/devanagari?page=3&id=BG_C03_V03&hl=%E0%A4%9C%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%9E%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%AF%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%97%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%A8%20%E0%A4%B8%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%99%E0%A5%8D%E2%80%8D%E0%A4%96%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%82%20%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%AF%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%97%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%A8%20%E0%A4%AF%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%97%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%8D
> > >
> > इति ।
> > तथा च पुत्राय आह भगवान् व्यासः — ‘द्वाविमावथ पन्थानौ’ (शां. २४१ । ६)
> > इत्यादि । तथा च क्रियापथश्चैव पुरस्तात् पश्चात्संन्यासश्चेति । एतमेव
> विभागं
> > पुनः पुनर्दर्शयिष्यति भगवान् — अतत्त्ववित् ‘अहङ्कारविमूढात्मा कर्ताहमिति
> > मन्यते’ (भ. गी. ३ । २७)
> > <
> >
> https://advaitasharada.sringeri.net/display/bhashya/Gita/devanagari?page=3&id=BG_C03_V27&hl=%E0%A4%85%E0%A4%B9%E0%A4%99%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B0%E0%A4%B5%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%82%E0%A4%A2%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B9%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%BF%20%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%A8%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%87
> > >,
> > तत्त्ववित्तु नाहं करोमि इति । तथा च ‘सर्वकर्माणि मनसा संन्यस्यास्ते’ (भ.
> > गी. ५ । १३)
> > <
> >
> https://advaitasharada.sringeri.net/display/bhashya/Gita/devanagari?page=5&id=BG_C05_V13&hl=%E0%A4%B8%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%B5%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A3%E0%A4%BF%20%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%B8%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A4%B8%E0%A4%82%E0%A4%A8%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%B8%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B8%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%87
> > >
> > इत्यादि
> > ॥
> >
> > The one who has the vision of the Atman/Brahman, there is no karma.  For
> > him karma sannyasa is the way.
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > *Best Regards,*
> > >
> > > *Krishna Kashyap*
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Dec 2, 2024 at 11:11 AM V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <
> > > advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >> In Advaita, the jiva is a product of avidya and Ishwara is a product
> of
> > >> Maya.
> > >> कार्यकारणोपाधिभेदाज्जीवेश्वरभेदोऽपि दृश्यते । Tripaadvibhuti
> > >> Mahanarayanopanishat.
> > >> कार्योपाधिरयं जीवः कारणोपाधिरीश्वरः । Shuka rahasya upanishat.
> > >>
> > >> Here kaarya means the body mind complex, the effect of the
> Trigunatmika
> > >> maayaa. And kAraNa refers to mAya/prakriti.  With body-mind complex as
> > >> Upadhi, the Pure consciousness Brahman, appears as the jiva.  With
> Maya
> > as
> > >> upAdhi, the same Pure Consciousness Brahman appears as Ishwara.
> > >>
> > >> While both are aupadhika, it is to be noted that the body-mind complex
> > >> identity is due to avidya and jivabhAva is thus a product of
> ignorance.
> > >> However, the Ishwara part is not to be seen so.  It is the Vedanta
> > shAstra
> > >> that posits the concept of Ishwara with a view to help the jiva to
> > evolve
> > >> gradually and realize the truth of its own true nature, Brahman. By
> > >> relating to that power called Ishwara, the jiva becomes pure in mind
> and
> > >> qualifies to know the Truth. Karma yoga and bhakti are possible only
> > >> towards Ishwara. All the Puranas and Itihasas and agamas talk about
> the
> > >> glory of Ishwara.  All this is an adhyAropa, deliberate positing, by
> the
> > >> shAstra.  The apavAda, negation, is done by the shAstra by point out
> > that
> > >> the created world, including the body mind complex, is a product of
> > pancha
> > >> bhutas, which, in turn are the products of mUla prakriti.  Thereby the
> > >> shAstra posit the concept of mUla prakriti, mAyA, too. And thereby
> > >> 'create'
> > >> the concept of Ishwara.
> > >>
> > >> A careful study of the Upanishads, the Bhagavatam, etc. along with the
> > >> Shankara and Sridhara Swamin's bhashya, etc. will reveal the above
> truth
> > >> of
> > >> the jiva and Ishwara being aupAdhika.
> > >>
> > >> warm regards
> > >> subbu
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