[Advaita-l] A seminal Truth explained by Bhagavan Ramana

kuntimaddi sadananda kuntimaddisada at yahoo.com
Sun May 13 08:26:02 EDT 2018

 Subbuji - PraNAms
 With my PraNAms to Bhagavan Ramana Maharshi.

Just some clarifications based on my understanding.



On Saturday, May 12, 2018, 10:37:26 PM EDT, V Subrahmanian via Advaita-l <advaita-l at lists.advaita-vedanta.org> wrote:



A seminal Truth explained by Bhagavan Ramana


Q: Will there be knowledge in the liberated state?


Ramana:  If there is no knowledge that is called sleep. Only if there is

knowledge it is the liberated state. But then, this knowledge is not the

one that occurs due to knower-known objectivity. It is Full Knowledge,

Purna Jnanam. There are two meanings for 'knowledge': 1. vaachyaartham - is

vrtti jnana and 2. Lakshyaartham is (svarupa) jnanam.


Sada: Both, vaachyaartha and lakshyaartham are actually pointers. The first one points out to an object that can be perceived or conceptualized. The second is only indicatory for the mind to uplift itself from the normal objective knowledge but to the very subject which cannot be objectified. tat tvam asi  pointer is indicatory with further confirmation by the scriptures that the subject that cannot be objected since it is self-revealing is the same as Brahman which is infinite and cannot also be objectified, as it is infinite. 


'If there is no knowledge that is called sleep' applies to swaruupa jnaanam too. How does a jnaani sleep? - if one asks. A simple answer can be - the question is invalid since jnaani being infinite cannot sleep - even though his body-mind-intellect (BMI) is sleeping. Of course this is true for ajnaani also but since he identifies himself with BMI, thinks he sleeps when BMI sleeps. The fact is both vaachyaartha and lakshyaarth jnaanam are not there in the deep sleep state and there is only akhandaakaara ajnaana vRitti in the mind as there is no knowledge of subject-object duality and also no swaruupa jjaanam since the mind is folded. In essence one can say - a jnaani sleeps as jnaani that is the mind that has the knowledge of ahama brahmasmi sleeps with that knowledge (even though he is ever awake), while ajnaani sleeps as ajnaani. 


In essence, both jnaani and ajnaani sleep with ignorance of all subject-object duality. 





Brahman, that is what the

seeker is, is called Jnanam by the Taittiriya Upanishad: Satyam, Jnanam,

Anantam.  The Brihadaranyaka calls it 'Vijnanam Anandam'. Thus, the svarupa

of the seeker is this Svarupa Jnanam. Liberation is to know that one is

this svarupa jnanam.  This occurs through the vritti jnanam 'aham brahma

asmi.'  The vritti rises and lapses and does not stay after the body of the

Jnani is gone, for there is no apparatus to either generate it or maintain

it. But what exists forever is the Svarupam that is Brahman.


Sada: Yes, even though brahmajnaanam is vRitti jnaanam - there is no phalavyaapti - unlike the vRitti jnaanam involved in all objective-knowledge including Vedantic knowledge. 


'Liberation is to know that one is this swaruupa jnaanam' - True - but who is the knower here? It is again the mind only or correctly the mind with chidabhaasa - where the swaruuap aspect is by identifying with the consciousness aspect that  is reflected leaving aside both the reflection and the reflecting medium (mind) - In that sense it is lakshaartha. 


'what exists forever is swaruupa jnaanam'  - I like to say what exits is only swaruupam and that is true all the time even in ajnaana kaale. Hence when the BMI drops and no driving force to be born again (no vaasanaas), then both jnaani and ajnaani notions drop out since these have no relevance from Brahman reference or from paaramaarthika reference.


My 2c


Hari Om!



More information about the Advaita-l mailing list